From Harford County Government:
BEL AIR, Md., (Jan. 26, 2015) – The Department of the Army will hold a community listening session on Thursday, January 29 from 6:00 – 8:00 p.m. at the Harford Technical High School Amoss Center, 200 Thomas Run Rd, Bel Air, regarding the potential loss of 4,300 military and civilian jobs at Aberdeen Proving Ground.
Show your support for Harford County’s leading economic engine and a center of excellence for research, development, test and evaluation for our nation’s defense. We need to pack the 1,000-seat auditorium and demonstrate to the Department of Defense our commitment to APG and its more than 90 tenant organizations. The specialized capabilities at Aberdeen Proving Ground make it a unique science and technology powerhouse paramount to the Capitol Region.
This listening session is a follow up to the Supplemental Programmatic Environmental Assessment (SPEA) released this past summer that indicated there would be no significant environmental impacts with the potential reduction of 4,300 jobs at Aberdeen Proving Ground. A strong unified community response at Aberdeen High School on August 4, 2014 expressed concern about the economic impact to our region where nearly 70 percent of APG’s workforce resides in Harford County.
Each of us has a family member or knows someone who works at APG; all of us benefit from the technology and testing that passes through our installation and keeps our nation and our soldiers safe. Please join us this Thursday, January 29, 2015. Let’s show up in strength and demonstrate the significance of APG to our community!
Get ready for everyone to be shipped to Huntsville. This has been in the planning stages long before BRAC but they couldn’t do it all at once so the NJ to MD was an intermediary step. If you think the Beech Creek homes are selling slow now, wait till this move becomes official.
One would assume that Andy Harris will be there to help his constituents.
Huntsville is nice.
I especially like the annual tornadoes there. You get to build yourself a new home (and maybe a base eventually) every so often.
Haven’t heard a thing about this on APG, but our leadership is so inept, we won’t be notified of this meeting until after it’s taken place.
Don’t worry, I worked their for 38 years and believe me, they’ll let you know on Friday at 4pm. just to give you something to think about over the weekend.
This is actually surprising that the APG leadership is participating in advertising this event. When the Fort Monmouth BRAC closure was in the planning and post-decision stages, local leadership told the employees that the decision had been made and that they could not advocate for opposition. The message was “it’s a done deal, get over it.” Public opposition was most definitely frowned upon.
Aberdeen and Harford County doesn’t have the same level of leadership as it did when the BRAC was formulated for this area. Tom Sadowski scripted the political leadership including Mikulski and Sarbanes and more than anyone else was the driving force that secured the BRAC. Craig lost Sadowski to the Economic Alliance of Greater Baltimore for a couple of bucks and we haven’t had any solid economic development leadership since.Couple that with the totally enept Aberdeen council and mayor and you have an evacuation coctail.
Its pretty sad seeing how former Beech Tree Golf has basically, empty houses all over it.
Across the street from Beech tree they cleared some land and built like 3 houses, looks like there is/was planning for more but that hasn’t moved in months.
No one wants their kids in the Aberdeen school district.
What’s going on up Route 7 before the traffic circle? Clearing for more houses? LOL
Aberdeen can’t even attract a business to lease their multiple story mega office next to Target that was finished 3 years ago, and they’re building MORE houses? LOL
As a taxpayer it’s even sadder still because we subsidized the entire development with a ridiculous, ill-advised TIF wrapped up in a big bow for Craig’s buddy, Clark Turner.
But come on, Mr. Turner needed that far more then the working class of this County,,HeHe Snark Snark, gotta love the Craig “friends and family program”!!!
The move of Bel Air Auto Parts from Rt 1 near the Harford Mall to this location on Rt. & is what’s going on there. A March 5, 2014 Baltimore Sun article titled “Plan to move Bel Air Auto Auction to Riverside raises traffic concerns” states, “The site, being developed as Riverside East Business Park, would combine four commercial lots into one and include two buildings, including the corporate offices for the auto auction.
Bel Air Auto Auction is part of BSCAmerica, which hopes to add 175 to 200 jobs when it moves to Riverside. The Bel Air site, which occupies a sprawling tract on Route 1 just west of the town limits, employs 475 people. The existing corporate headquarters is nearby.
As proposed, the Riverside site would have three access points onto Route 7, including two roundabouts at Seven Trails Drive and Holly Oaks Circle. The plan is to pull trucks and other auction-related traffic off Route 7 at the westernmost access point so they would only circulate through a private network of roads inside the auction site, with minimal impact on Route 7 traffic, explained Jeff Matthai of Morris & Ritchie Associates, the project engineer.”
I cannot fathom how stupid it would be for the Army to move Fort Monmouth mission to APG (at a cost of several billion dollars), and then vacate these shiny, new buildings (that are already beginning to show their age) to go to Huntsville. It would be stupid, embarrassing, and an additional waste of taxpayer money….which means the Army will probably do it.
I thought the main purpose of BRAC, at least as it is presented to the taxpayers, is to reduce unneeded/unused infrastructure, you know non-personnel items like buildings, property, etc. If not then clearly “B-R-A-C” is now spelled “R-I-F”. Of course when there are real estate fortunes to be made by the BRAC insiders, the rules get tweaked to meet those ends. Would be a good CNN or Fox News investigation/documentary wouldn’t you say?
It’s gotten to the point where my kids and I play a game of “What is the Stupidest Thing the Federal Government Could Possibly Do” and when you’ve come up with your most outlandish guess, you can rest assured the Federal Government will leave you breathless. Let’s see, move people from NJ incurring the resultant loss in productivity by upheaval of offices, equipment, families searching for housing, (did they pay relocation fees?) etc. Spend millions on multiple new structures; completely rework the base entrance, moving the gate, widening the roadways and ramps off 40. Kick people out of their homes at 22 and Paradise to widen the road and everything else I’ve missed and then announce that 4,300 jobs will be booted. They do things like this because it’s NOT THEIR MONEY. The people that make decisions like these should be fired and have all present and future benefits stripped.
In 2005, the managers at Ft. Monmouth were told, almost ordered, to hire like crazy in order to offset the anticipated loss of personnel who would not move to APG. The managers looked at each other like this was nuts but went ahead AS DIRECTED. So now in some areas they over hired; whose fault was that now? As for relocation fees, real estate costs, they low balled you to death. Several that sold their homes had to invest in expensive home improvements and repairs in order to qualify for HAP; I’ve heard now that even that has gotten reduced. The paperwork for all this alone was like working a full time job; incredible. You show them a receipt for a credit reporting fee of $50 and then they give you $44 just to make you fight for it. Movers broke items and the paperwork, photos to get reimbursed pennies on the dollar. Total disrespect. Then the “Oh, well this doesn’t include this” or “Well that doesn’t count” BS. NJ employment, especially in the Ft. Monmouth area is still dismal to this day and the main gate is still closed and locked most of the time. No Deja Vu please thank you.
You act like movers breaking stuff and short-changing the reimbursement isn’t a common occurence.
APG is not going to close because there is too much environmentally unfriendly items in the soil. There are so many folks leaving DOD with early retirement and incentives that the 4,300 will have little impact when all is said and done.
Homes are being build in Harford County long after BRAC because there is little planning in “Planning and Zoning.” Instead, reaction has been the form of leadership used under Craig in this County. Now that Craig and his Planning and Zoning head are no longer in office, we shall see how the new administration handles the fires created.
The event to impart information regarding the “impact of the POTENTIAL reduction of 4,300 jobs at Aberdeen Proving Ground.” is a LISTENING event.
People of Harford County a POTENTIAL change, that may not happen, but WE are going to tell YOU how it is going to go, SO come and LISTEN to how WE want YOUu to think about this POTENTIAL change.
Really not worth my time. I’d rather work somewhere off of the base, where Harford County actually can collect taxes and grow the County. Instead of worrying about potential reductions of arbitrary numbers of jobs at APG; being grateful for low impact (to the people who live here) services, which are well marketed; and having the County keep losing money to contractors building on County-free tax property on APG; perhaps the logical residents of Harford County might not waste their time attending LISTENING meetings. Instead, perhaps it might be wiser to wait for the natural adjustment of the job buildup after 9-1-1 and hope that all of the contracting companies don’t move onto APG and avoid County Tax, add to traffic congestion and remove any hope that local leadership might…well PLAN AND LEAD.
The Army has wanted to consolidate operations at Huntsville for a very long time. In the last BRAC Army Materiel Command HQ was moved from Alexandria to Huntsville. While APG may not close, you better believe that they want their major subordinate commands (of which CECOM is one of those) to be co-located with them. This is a question of when, not if, this move will happen. Also – all the leadership at AMC who were forced to move the long distance to Alabama are none too happy that a very large number of CECOM employees never moved because they have some commuting arrangement between NJ and MD. They ant that to stop, and eventually, it will.
and consolidating everything at one location subject to natural disasters like tornadoes is a good idea? Again, what are the COOP/backup locations? Terrorists can strike at one location and disable a whole command.. Great Strategy.
As far as I’m aware, they aren’t hiring any (or significant) number of people outside of MD. With the past 3 years of hiring freezes, furloughs, etc, they haven’t really been able to hire anyone for that matter. As for people buying homes at APG, with these rumors going on about another BRAC and or RIF now, they clearly don’t see that as a good idea right now for obvious reasons. Others also waited for the real estate craze and inflated BRAC 2005 prices to level down.
Is there anything official in the way of a tentative or firm decision being made public? It is ever challenging to find non- rumored information, and I am an APG employee. Would like any additional information as it becomes available. Also, what might the timeline be for the announcement and the implementation of the BRAC to Huntsville, AL?
I believe that this is not BRAC2 it is more about reducing the workforce at APG. The jobs aren’t moving, they are being eliminated altogether. Obama needs to eliminate employees so he has money to pay for all the free stuff for wetbacks and lazy people.
Yeah, why go to school, pay high tuition and educate yourself and deal with a stressful job with no security? Live stress free and be lazy and get things for free at other people’s expense. This free Community College baloney? What a masterpiece that would be. Spend tons of money on people to major in stupid, non-employable fields, and well perhaps in STEM fields for a few but who won’t get jobs when the graduate anyway. They ought to present your diploma with one-way airfare to China or India to get your job.
I hope I don’t offend anyone but I did work at Fort Monmouth and was able to retire and avoid moving to Maryland. I hope this hurts, really hurts, the Maryland politicians who did their best to take CECOM from Fort Monmouth with its resultant pain for many. I hope those politicians get voted out.
Typical near-term or retired Fed with the “I don’t give a c*** about the remaining work force” but I’m “safe”. Sure genius, what good would hurting MD do to the workforce? Send us back to NJ? Think much farther than that.
You misunderstood, Tommy. My reference was to the Maryland politicians who pulled off the move from Monmouth to APG based upon fraud. They should pay the price, not the employees.
Better that MD politicians were able to pull off the move to MD than the Alabama politicians wouldn’t you say, but who knows during the next round. I think the whole process is crooked and those in the know are getting rich off of it. As far as paying the price, the employees are going to pay and they always do. Seriously, do you think an agency that trains people to fight and kill and deal with dying or maimed solders/veterans has a heart or compassion for victimized civil servants?
My position still stands too, that by and large the vast majority of retirees lately do not care about the workplace environment they are leaving behind and those who work there. Those drawing now extinct but very healthy pensions are largely not as subject to the fiscal sacrifices that many workers today are making or will be making towards their retirement plans.
Good news is that there will be a lot less bad drivers flying down the merge onto 40 from 715. Half of those teet suckers don’t even look before they merge.
Idiots. You know at 430 everyday traffic is backed up.
Maryland drivers just need to drive like Jersey drivers. Problem solved.
I laugh whenever I run into a person disobeying the rules of the road in a traffic circle in Harford County. The majority of the time, they have NJ plates and APG stickers…
What is happening here is a microcosim of what happened in the past with Bell labs. Engineering and Science fields are loosing. Pretty soon, no American will have any incentive to become an Engineer. I am not saying that (presently) APG does completely cutting edge work. But I am saying that this will make a bad situation, even worse. Why should the average person be concerned about this? Because innovation, inventions, patents are what has historically driven our economy. When all other countries were compared to the U.S. none were as inventive as us. And historically, that made our economy strong. 20 years from now, I would not be surprised if the U.S. turns into a 3rd world country. The Army could do much better, with the educated Engineers and Scientists there. APG is just a small example of what is happening Nationally. It would be great if the American people, and the Army could lead in this area, and would believe in Science and Engineering again.
But the engineers have to do a bit of soul searching as well. My R&D engineer friends are complaining that they are being asked to justify every little thing they do, and are not happy about it. They want to be able to have no accountability to anyone and just work in secret behind closed doors doing their research. That is unrealistic in a time of constrained resources.
I have been following this thread and can not wrap my head around the lack of information displayed by a great number of folks on here. If the comments come from government workers they are especially bad and uninformed. The “C” in BRAC stands for commission. The commission is formed by an act of Congress to determine where and how the DOD can eliminate real estate assets by consolidation. When the final report comes in from the independant commission, the Congress must vote to accept or reject the suggestions. The Maryland and New Jersey politicians have nothing to do with the process until it is a done deal. All the chatter about Huntsville is simply that, chatter. AMC was moved from leased buildings in the DC area to Government owned property in Alabama. Likewise the Ft. Monmouth closing was in order to move CECOM, not from leased but away from the large number of buildings they occupied at Monmouth. Aberdeen Proving Ground and the local politicians tried to make the move as comfortable as possible, including a multitude of visits to Monmouth to provide information. As Al Thong points out, the current Aberdeen administration, which came in in 2007, had no interest in any housing or development and basically shoved their collective heads into the ground. Our roads and access to them was not taken care of, leading to an absolute traffic nightmare.
The current Reduction In Force activity is brought on by the Command Authority’s desire to gut the military through an Obama inspired gimmick called “sequestration.” Don’t take it personally, it’s just that very few folks in DC care two hoots in hell about all of our defense department. Maybe you can get us some better leadership in 2016.
Finally – Having been in the Signal Corps for more than twenty years, including assignments at Ft. Monmouth, I can say that the move to close Monmouth was brilliant. Like most big organizations, CECOM was top heavy with high paying, low performing old timers. The BRAC caused a bunch ot them to retire, making way for new blood and fresh ideas. That can only be good!
As for locating a major military command to Huntsville just because of cheap cost of living consider these sobering statistics, some very recent:
The Wizard of Oz” may have taught us that tornadoes are a worry in Kansas, but it’s really people in Alabama who need to watch out for the deadly storms. According to a new list compiled by The Weather Channel’s tornado expert Dr. Greg Forbes, three of the worst cities for tornado damage are all in the Yellowhammer State.
Dr. Forbes has been making an annual list of the ten worst tornado cities for a while now, but this year he added additional types of data going all the way back to 1962. “The difference between this year’s list and the ones in the past is the past ones were just counting the sheer number of tornadoes,” he said in a Weather Channel article about the list. “That didn’t take into consideration the track length or path width. Thus it didn’t count how big of an area was being affected by the tornadoes.” According to Forbes’ calculations, Huntsville, Ala., is the worst city in America for tornado damage. One of the largest tornado “outbreaks” in U.S. history occurred in Huntsville on April 27, 2011, when nine people were killed. Another Alabama city, Birmingham, ranked third on Forbes’ list. The city suffered 109 tornado deaths between 1950 and 2012. Tuscaloosa, which was also heavily hit by the 2011 storm, was close behind in fourth place; the city lost 43 people during that storm.
More than one significant tornado has stuck Huntsville, Alabama in its history.
The Super Outbreak caused damage in Huntsville in April 1974.
An F4 tornado struck the southern portion of the city on November 15, 1989.
The Anderson Hills Tornado, also an F4, struck the city on May 18, 1995.
A January 21, 2010 tornado struck near Five Points.
The April 25–28, 2011 tornado outbreak.
Two tornadoes struck north of the city on March 2, 2012.”
Maybe then there is a reason why it’s so cheap to live there wouldn’t you say?
I think all these moves toward that area are going to be very regrettable in the near future and would certainly give terrorists and other world enemies a most opportune moment to strike when a major US DoD command loses a debilitating battle to none other than Mother Nature.
Every time I see someone changing lanes, driving wreckelessly, speeding, and tail gating it’s almost always someome with New Jersey plates or those rectangular elite job stickers at the bottom drivers side window.
Bunch of morons. Aberdeen to Edgewood has like 9 traffic lights in 9 miles. Doesn’t matter how much of a hurry you are in, you really “don’t get there” faster than someone cruising in the right hand lane.
This is rich, Aberdeen is a cesspool and the Army should have gotten out of there a long time ago. The only person who got it right is “a says” and the BS about tornado is nothing more than fear mongering. As for CECOM being a major command, I’m sure you want it to be but its just a 2 Star billet, sorry it is not a major command by any stretch. I am sure it is important and as an employee i trust you feel some amount of loyalty to CECOM. I went to school twice in APG I hated it while I was there, I some how pissed off the Red Gods of Personnel and was assigned to APG for 7 years and I hated it every minute. I ran afoul of the Cecile County Mafia (DOD civilians that lived in Cecile County) while assigned there and it cost me as my career as it pretty much ended because I turned one of them in for theft.
Between the lack of support from the locals, the cost of cleaning all of the HAZMAT areas, the Good ole Boys, and of course the cost of living for the soldiers, the Army just needs to get the hell out of there. I hope that the Defense Base Closure and Realignment Commission completely closes the cesspool that is APG!
Doubt they’ll close it after they spendin’ all that coin to upgrade that +50 year old treatment plant in Edgewood.
Aberdeen is not a cesspool. Admittedly there are a couple turds floating around City Hall.