From Fran Salbeck:
Letter to the Editor,
The Save the Pool Property Committee held an informal public meeting on Monday July 21 at the Southern Precinct Police Station.
There were close to 130 citizens in attendance.
Written questions regarding the current and future status of the pool property were collected from the attendees and submitted to members of the committee and Councilman Dion Guthrie.
This was a public and open meeting.
One of the main reasons for the meeting – was that Sonia Suber of the Mary Harvin Transformational Community Development Corporation (which is in care of Rev Hickman )has applied for a Smart Growth Impact Fund Grant. This is a State of Maryland Grant.
The following is some of the information that was shared with those in attendance.
The committee has been working for over a year on this issue.
We have met with and been in contact with representatives from the County Council, the County Executive’s Office, Parks and Recreation and State Officials.
We have been both hopeful and led on by County Officials as well as disappointed though out this past year.
The pool property could have and should have been purchased by Harford County for a much needed Community Center for the Joppa/Joppatowne area.
This is some of the information we do know:
The Southern Baptist Church of Baltimore has purchased the property-
The Southern Baptist Church is NOT affiliated with the Southern Baptist Convention-
Rev. Hickman stated “we are just named Southern Baptist Church”
The vision of the church has changed over time–It started out as a community life center with 400 to 600 seat sanctuary-
Then the vision was for the church to accommodate 200 people who attend in Aberdeen and a community center with a gym ,classrooms, childcare facility and 300 parking spaces-
NOW it has expanded into building a family and life center to facilitate a variety of youth and senior needs, activities would include sports training, mental health services to support veterans suffering from Post Traumatic Syndrome, behavioral and life coaching as well as early Childhood Head Start programs and after care for Joppatowne and adjacent communities.
We know that many of these services are offered at other health facilities in both Joppa and Edgewood and The Epicenter in Edgewood.
We don’t need these services in the middle of residential Joppatowne!
As some one has said “our high school has a saying — Your Towne —My Towne— Our Towne— J- Towne”
Lets borrow it and stand together for OUR TOWNE!!!
Fran Salbeck
The Save the Pool Property Committee
So basically you are saying, care for those in need shouldnt be on a property surrounded by commerce which happens to be in a largely but not exclusively residential town. There is more need for such services, and faith based organizations can provide services in a different way than secular non-profits and government based centers. Why don’t you just come out and say it, you don’t want “that element” in your back yard.
Any bets this post is Rev Hickman?
You should have bought the pool your self. The previous owner couldn’t make a go of the business but I didn’t see anything stopping you from giving it a try.
Your comment reflects your ignorance of the issues. Residents in Joppatowne were not aware of the sale of the property until it was pretty much a done deal. Like so many such deals (remember the homeless shelter?) in Harford County, this type of transactions seems to be intended to be kept secret until it is too late to do anything about the plans. There was someone at one of the first meetings who was willing to buy and develp the property, but a contract .with the church was already pending.
Whoa, talk about butt hurt. You stormed out of the meeting because you thought the rules shouldn’t apply to you, like your the king of Joppatowne.
You and Guthrie love to blame all this on the county, maybe it’s just bad business to buy a 50 year old pool. If it was so great and profitable you wouldn’t have sold it.
That was meant for Boardman’s mile long rant, but doesn’t matter, works for both of these nimbys.
The Southern Baptist Church owns the property….get over it. You had just as much chance to buy it, you lose.
Me thinks, sadly, a bit of racism is going on here.
Hate to tell you but the pool leaks and would need major work to be viable as a pool. Mr. Stephens interest was never making money but housing a training site for NBAC. Once forced to divest from NBAC he was looking to get rid of it fast to help pay his legal expenses.
I think people should be more informed before they speak and jump to conclusions. I am raising a 4th generation of Joppatowne residents and have seen our community go through many changes over my years here. None of them as large as this project. The bottom line is it is just too large and is not a proper location.
1. The pool was not sold because the owners could not make a go of the business. They retired and sold all of their properties which included multiple swim clubs.
2. The community would have liked to purchase the property but a for sale sign was not visible to the community.
3.”that element” is already present in our community so no we don’t want competitive programs coming into the center of our community.
4. “Me thinks, sadly, a bit of racism is going on here.” Really? We are a well blended community and support the community as a whole entity.
It’s funny how when someone doesn’t agree the “RACE CARD” is always played. Seriously people? We don’t need this facility here. Plain and simple. Stop calling people racists because they don’t agree with you. ITS A BULLY TACTIC!!!!
I don’t care if we have a pool or not. We don’t need another church bringing in “community services” that are already available. It would be nice to have the pool, but for whatever reason it’s not working out. From what I found during research, the owners did not sell due to the lack of profit reason, they were retiring and didn’t have the time or desire to invest in fixing the property further or running the pool. And all this “why didn’t you buy it” crap is stupid. As if one private entity in Joppatowne is going to have 750 mill or whatever to buy a pool for personal gain. The county was outbid by the church. If maybe the church had understood and backed off because of the lack of community interest, the county would have owned the property. If they were seriously looking out for the interest of the community, they would have realized there was NO interest, and moved on to another location. Why build where you are not wanted? Why not practice care for fellow human beings and let them have what is best for them, a community run center instead of forcing your own agenda on the community? How about supporting the people in your own communities of Baltimore and Aberdeen? Joppatowne doesn’t need or want your church and its services.
Doesn’t this church already have around 300 members in the Joppatowne and Edgewood area, attending their church? Seems to me that indicates an interest from the community.
No they don’t. Their community is in Aberdeen and Baltimore. There may be a few here and there from Edgewood and Joppa, but the majority of their congregations are centered around those two locations. Even if it were 200 people from Edgewood and Joppa, that isn’t a big enough amount of people to consider it a general or large/majority “interest” from the community. The opposition is about 1000 people strong on the facebook page alone. Seems to me the interest is far outweighed by the disinterest. Edgewood has no stake in this as it is not going in their community. I don’t consider an Edgewood person’s opinion as a valid community opinion on what is going on in Joppatowne. You live here, you get an opinion. If you don’t, I don’t care what you have to say about whether you feel this is a good idea for Joppatowne or not. I could say I feel that a rec center in Baltimore or Aberdeen is a good idea, as an example, but my opinion doesn’t mean crap since I don’t live there. Why should I care about the opinions of people that don’t live here? They have no stake in the betterment of our community or desire to help it in a beneficial way. Hell the politicians don’t even care. If outsiders care so much about Joppatowne (which I don’t buy) then they should listen to the citizens of the town.
I love people that post without their real names. What are you hiding from?
Once again you are correct Amy!
This is clearly not about our community but a way for an outsider to come in and try to make money off of our community. He has already stated that the facilities would be available for a nominal fee. The members of the church do not live in our community and the church itself is not even recognized by the Southern Baptist Convention. I feel like it is a slap in the face to our already established Baptist churches in Joppatowne for them to come in and compete against them. I also feel like it is very disrespectful to come in and say they are going to rebuild our community as if there is something wrong with our community. They are judging us and considering us to need the rebuilding and I am very offended by that statement. Not to mention the fact that why would we pay to use facilities that we don’t want!
I also noticed a lot of missing names. I guess they can’t put their name on their pushy opinions.
I’m hiding from the same thing you are.
Pot calls kettle black? What difference if I use this name, or a random first name. What’s your last name?
I used my last name with several posts earlier. I am not afraid of anything and I am not hiding anything. I didn’t make up some fake name so that I can’t be held accountable for my opinions or information I share.
“If they were seriously looking out for the interest of the community, they would have realized there was NO interest, and moved on to another location. Why build where you are not wanted? Why not practice care for fellow human beings and let them have what is best for them, a community run center instead of forcing your own agenda on the community? ”
You are 100% correct Amy!
the biggest complaint I’ve heard is that the county, for whatever reason, didn’t seem to put forth any really effort in making a realistic bid for the property. Meanwhile, most other communities in Harford county have new, state of the art, recreation centers. Churchville, Jarrettsville, Fallston, just to name a few. And the council and/or executive seem to have problem bidding above market value for other properties.
It’s disheartening that even with obvious and loud community desire, the county essentially thumbed its nose at Joppatowne.
As for the racist and NIMBY remarks, I count Mrs. Salbeck as a close friend (almost family) and can assure you that is not the case.
Yall got a river to swim in. Don’t need no pool, got dayumnit.
Troll.
I have been watching the comments and it’s just hilarious to me that you are holding meetings, writing post, forming groups, missing time from your jobs, family and friends – upset about something you don’t control. You or Guthrie or anyone else can no more tell Southern Baptist Church what to do with that pool than I can tell my neighbor she doesn’t need another flag in her front yard. Sorry.. And it doesn’t matter if Racism is behind this or not. The bottom line is the property belongs to Southern Baptist Church/Mary Harvin Transformation Center. However always remember money talks not your formal or informal meetings!
Again more people afraid to post with their real names.
We may not have the money of a large church conglomerate, but maybe we can get through to the people of the Southern Baptist Church and get them to reconsider moving to someplace where they may be received with open arms vs a large opposition. It’s like going to sit down at a table for lunch with people that don’t want your company. Why would you want to go where you are not wanted? Why elbow your way in? Where is the sense in this? Why not take a poll BEFORE you buy property to see how the community will receive you instead of having this “We bought it, we’re coming whether you like it or not” attitude? That is where the lack of common sense lies. That is why there is hostility and resentment. The church cannot deal with the fact that they are not welcomed by the majority here. So instead of reconsidering, they come in with a bigger attitude, throw out the race card, and proceed to bristle more feathers. Mr. Hickman posts cropped photos of white people, and then says our community is not diverse. If that’s true, then why would you want to come here if we are so racist? The fact of the matter is that it isn’t true, this is a diverse community that has been coming together to try to combat this situation. I’m sorry if Mr. Hickman and his congregation don’t like their not-so-warm welcome. He can pick up his ball and go home again if he doesn’t like it.
Also, we can most certainly tell the church they will not get a grant from the state to do this. Guthrie can say so as well. Whether he does so remains to be seen, but I believe the grand was already turned down. You may be able to come here, but we don’t have to use our state funds to pay for it. Raise your own money.
Yes they were denied the recent grant that they applied for. The grant they wre trying to get does not fit the project they are trying to use it for. However I do believe that somewhere it was stated to them that Edgewood would fall under the grant.
I love it when internet users try to validate their debates by countering, “I used my real name, and you didn’t ” its meaningless, this isn’t a City Council meeting.
The block field says, “Name.” It doesn’t say, “Your real christain born name.”
Welcome to the internet. Anyone on Planet Earf’ can comment here. Why would they? That’s not my business, but its the internet, and is a good form of entertainment to see other peolet make it their business, getting hot and bothered.
You don’t know what you are talking about and it’s no wonder you don’t use your real name.
We don’t need no god dam black christian church in joppatown. It’s taken us years to turn it into waterbillie heaven and they ain’t gonna change it now.
Bel air and or Fallston could use a church such as this, they need some diversity in these communities.
not in my back yard
If I want diversity, I will move to Joppatowne or Aberdeen
Typical..Im not for the church but sure as hell am not on your side with a comment like that!!! Stay in Falston !!!
I’ll stay in Boca thank you very much.
for one am 100% against the destruction of our community pool!! It was stripped away from us because of a sexual child predator who would wait for the funds to be available,which is my understanding,and went with the lower offering!Joppatown does NOT NEED another 600 cars coming through it!! I live on Joppa Farm Rd and can not even pull out safely any longer! I am a LIFE LONG resident of Jopptown.My father bought this house in 1962,,I was born in 69 and purchased it in 97.As a child,we could cross the street safely but not anymore! I have had signs erected saying for the state law to be obeyed when people are in the crosswalks and they still dont stop! I have to stop traffic for parents and kids to be able to cross safely!!! When I stop for pedestrians in crosswalks,cars go around on my right crossing a solid line because they dont want to wait..how much worse will it be with 600 more cars on almost a daily basis??? And to the comment that we dont want it in our back yard,well,put it in your backyard!!! This community was devastated over the loss of the pool! we have 11 churchs in the Jtown area.. why do we need another???? Race card is a joke!!! I have volunteered for Edgewood and Joppatown football programs for years so race has absolutely nothing to do with it!!!
And YES,we can still fight any new building by blocking permits through impact research on the traffic alone! They should be Godly people and look to why we dont want it in our community… I also read that the county was over bid… I was under the impression that the county over bid them but the owner wouldnt wait for the end of the annual budget.If im wrong Im wrong but dont pretend that it will be a good thing…we already have damage to the roads from the winter.. what will it be like with all the heavy equipment being driven in and out of OUR TOWN!?And to response to GO SWIM IN THE RIVER… GO BUILD THE CHURCH SOMEWHERE THAT ITS WANTED!!!If the pool leaks,which I never heard before,it can be fixed…
Victor Buchwald
Sorry for the typos..my
some comments are coming up under my name and it IS NOT ME!!! Someone wants to make this racist and is childish!!!
This is my only main post other then the typo\
for one am 100% against the destruction of our community pool!! It was stripped away from us because of a sexual child predator who would wait for the funds to be available,which is my understanding,and went with the lower offering!Joppatown does NOT NEED another 600 cars coming through it!! I live on Joppa Farm Rd and can not even pull out safely any longer! I am a LIFE LONG resident of Jopptown.My father bought this house in 1962,,I was born in 69 and purchased it in 97.As a child,we could cross the street safely but not anymore! I have had signs erected saying for the state law to be obeyed when people are in the crosswalks and they still dont stop! I have to stop traffic for parents and kids to be able to cross safely!!! When I stop for pedestrians in crosswalks,cars go around on my right crossing a solid line because they dont want to wait..how much worse will it be with 600 more cars on almost a daily basis??? And to the comment that we dont want it in our back yard,well,put it in your backyard!!! This community was devastated over the loss of the pool! we have 11 churchs in the Jtown area.. why do we need another???? Race card is a joke!!! I have volunteered for Edgewood and Joppatown football programs for years so race has absolutely nothing to do with it!!!
And YES,we can still fight any new building by blocking permits through impact research on the traffic alone! They should be Godly people and look to why we dont want it in our community… I also read that the county was over bid… I was under the impression that the county over bid them but the owner wouldnt wait for the end of the annual budget.If im wrong Im wrong but dont pretend that it will be a good thing…we already have damage to the roads from the winter.. what will it be like with all the heavy equipment being driven in and out of OUR TOWN!?And to response to GO SWIM IN THE RIVER… GO BUILD THE CHURCH SOMEWHERE THAT ITS WANTED!!!If the pool leaks,which I never heard before,it can be fixed…
Victor Buchwald
.
Any moran knows a church only open 1 day a week on Sunday will produce way more traffic than a pool open 7 days a week.
Are you all stupit?
Any Moran that doesn’t know how to spell the darn word should be condemned to live in Joppatowne or Edgewood and attend Rte 40 anonymous meetings. The first step is to admit that you have a problem and the 2nd would be to take remedial English classes or English as a 2nd language. moran?
And what word is that telephone tough guy???lol
chill dude..
ARE YOU SERIOUS… ONLY 1 DAY A WEEK?? Sure,all activities only happen from 9-10 and 11-12 on sunday… call whatever names you want but I think your idea of a center that they are wanting to create will be a lil more then just sunday.. I worked in the church… probably 30 hrs a week at one point.
The county doesn’t want to spend $$$ in Joppatowne because Guthrie would take credit for it and the rest of the council would rather have yet another Church in the area. I wonder if their indifference would be the same if say a Muslim group wanted to build a Mosque? Hypocrisy at the finest it can get. Wondering that if this lot was in a Republican district if they would feel the same just as indifferent about the community. The county seems to have funds to buy a lot designated for a trash dump in the area but anything that will actually help the community says a lot about their indifference about Edgewood and Joppatowne.
indifference is big word, but do you really need to use it 3 times in a short paragraph–Try disregard, nonchalance, detachment, disinterest or whatever… kind of indifferent about the whole thing…
Absolutely right. I have heard a certain county government official talk badly about Guthrie behind his back. In public she is just as friendly to him as can be…almost looks like her face is going to crack.
Im not from this community and even i can see that this is wrong.
if you build it they will come!! enough jesus freaks in our county
Is this John Doe guy from the Jtown community or just someone trying to stir up stuff.??
WOW!! It’s amazing the negative remarks in regards to a church being built in the area. Whodathunk!
Sounds to me like a great place to house Obozo and Owe Malley’s, “New Americans”
I think that some of the behavior and comments from both sides are uncalled for. The gossip and name calling from Pastor Hickman’s followers (in particular Gloria Pollard) are not something I would expect from a group of people that call themselves Christians. To copy and paste conversations to your facebook page and then say that we need prayer is not shedding you in a good light. I would expect more from a man of God. Our neighborhood is as diverse as one can get and we are a close community. To assume that one person that makes a stupid comment about not wanting a black church in our community is a representative of how we all feel is ignorant on your part. That’s like assuming that Gloria Pollard calling us a bunch of racist aliens that made her feel like she was in the movie “War of the Worlds” is exactly how the entire Southern Baptist Church feels. And all this because we started our community meeting out by saying The Pledge of Allegiance instead of opening with prayer. As a member of the Joppatowne Community that comes from a family of Pastors, and raised in a Baptist church, I pray that people can start acting like adults and get to the real problems and concerns that we have over having another church in our community. The following list is just a portion of the number of churches within a seven mile radius from the former Joppatowne Pool. Honesty will get you further than lies and name calling. Lets act like adults!
This is just a short list of the churches in proximity to 512 Joppa Farm Road, Joppa, MD 21085
1. Upper Room Gospel Tabernacle 5.6 miles
1806 Heim Ln Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 676-5734
2. Christ Dominion Chapel 0.8 miles
626 Towne Center Dr Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 510-7816
3. Joppatowne Christian Church 1 mile
725 Trimble Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-9366
4. Faith Baptist Church 2.8 miles
1305 Joppa Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-1305
5. Community Baptist Church 2.4 miles
303 Philadelphia Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-9631
6. Towne Baptist Church 1.7 miles
536 Trimble Rd Ste A Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-2030
7. Trinity Reformed 4.3 miles
2907 Mountain Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 671-9920
8. Ebenezer Baptist Church 0.8 miles
508 Foster Branch Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-4837
9. Gethsemane Missonary Baptist 1.0 miles
502 Haverhill Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 538-6533
10. Maple View Baptist Church 7.1 miles
1600 Singer Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 676-3786
11. Good Shepherd Presbyterian Church 0.4 miles
622 Joppa Farm Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-3322
12. Holy Spirit Church Holy Spirit 0.1 miles
540 Joppa Farm Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-2191
13. Mountain Christian Church 6.3 miles
1824 Mountain Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 877-1824
14. Franklinville Presbyterian Church 4.5 miles
11846 Franklinville Rd Kingsville, MD 21087
(410) 592-6878
15. Union Chapel United Mthdst Church 7.1 miles
1012 Old Joppa Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 877-3246
16. Bethel Baptist Church 7.7 miles
1501 Stockton Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 676-3737
17. Bridge Of Hope Community Church 3.0 miles
513 Philadelphia Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-1440
18. Sovereign Grace Church 1.2 miles
900 Trimble Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-8815
19. St Alban’s Anglican Church 7.1 miles
1011 Old Joppa Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 877-3073
20. Seventh-Day Adventist Church 7.1 miles
1010 Old Joppa Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 877-8153
21. Church of The Resurrection 1.1 miles
Bridge Rd & Anchor Dr Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-8700
22. Fellowship Primitive Baptist Church 2.3 miles
111 Fern Dr Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-7443
23. Chesapeake Community Church 1.2 miles
900 Trimble Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 676-2979
24. Church Of The Resurrection 1.1 miles
700 Anchor Dr Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-8700
25. Trinity Lutheran Child Care 3.9 miles
1100 Philadelphia Rd Joppa, MD 21085
(410) 679-4000
26. Forge Road Bible Chapel 5.3 miles
5040 Forge Rd Perry Hall, MD 21128
(410) 256-5820
27. New Hope Christian Fellowship 4.7 miles
2048 Watergate Ct Edgewood, MD 21040
(410) 676-3531
28. More Than Cnqrs Wrshp 3.9 miles
2216 Hanson Rd Edgewood, MD 21040
(443) 922-7668
29. Fruitful Living Christian Center 3.3 miles
2104 Trimble Rd Edgewood, MD 21040
(410) 671-9176
30. Rooted Bible Fellowship Church 3.5 miles
1605 Waltman Rd Edgewood, MD 21040
(410) 612-0022
31. St. Stephen Catholic Church 4.7 miles
8028 Bradshaw Road Kingsville, MD 21087
(410) 592-7617
I pray I make more money tomorrow, than a I did yesterday. As you can tell, my long list of acronyms if achievements, I’m very successful.
Try selling real estate in Joppatowne, that will be a booming business soon.
Christine thank you for presenting such a good list. We clearly have many many religions and choices available to us in Joppatowne. I would like to point out that some of the horrible comments were made falsely using other people’s names. The racist remarks by Amy and Victor were not real and they were reported.
Jennifer, thank you for clarifying. I could not believe that a comment like that actually came from someone in our community and I should have known better. There seems to be some immature people that like to stir up trouble and insert themselves where they have no place. I have noticed the same comments and names posted under other subjects within The Daggerpress. The list that I provided was just a small number of the churches that are within a close proximity to where the pool property is located. I could have listed 50 more within a 5 mile radius if I included Abingdon and Edgewood. The point I was making is that we do not need another place of worship. I fear that financial gain is what is driving this man into our community based on what I have learned.