From the Harford County Education Association (HCEA):
Educators Speak Out for Improved School Funding
Educators in Harford County have had enough! Over the past two days, more than a thousand teachers and support professionals from 30 schools have walked out of school and picketed after their work day. They are calling for the County Council and the Board of Education to sufficiently fund education in Harford County.
“People stay here for a reason—we don’t want to let our children down. We shouldn’t have to make a choice between these children and our own livelihood,” said Katie Wheatley, a teacher at Magnolia Elementary School in Edgewood.
But that is exactly what educators across the county are asked to do every day. “I would like to invite Superintendent Tomback for a typical dinner at my house of Oodles of Noodles or mac and cheese”, says Wheatley. Teachers have seen no increase in base salary and no contractual experience increases (“steps”) in four years. During that time increased health care and pension costs have further decreased their salaries.
Educators across the county expressed their frustration at the County Council for failing to fund education, by demonstrating outside the schools with signs saying, “Fund Our Children’s Future” and “Honk for Education”.
Teachers and support professionals have filled County Council and School Board meeting rooms. The effort to “work to contract” has expanded county-wide and plans are to carry the effort over into the new school year.
“’Working to contract’ means working only one’s contracted hours to prepare and deliver instruction. This means that teachers are not doing the thousands of additional hours every week that they volunteer and not accepting additional volunteer assignments,” said Randy Cerveny, Harford County Education Association President. “This is difficult for teachers who love their students and go above and beyond for them,” he added. “But, in spite of the pain this causes them, our effort to call public attention to the needs of the schools and students is spreading.”
Once again the union gets it wrong. The Board of Education nor Dr. Tomback fund education. The County Executive and the Council fund education. The County Executive had a budget hearing and only 10 or so teachers show up. The County Council’s first budget hearing only a handful of teachers showed up. The Board and the Superintendent requested over 23 million dollars to fund raises and that was rejected by the County Executive and Council. If raises are given by the Board, teachers and other employees will feel the pain somewhere.
Oldtimer…”Once again” it would be respectable for Dr. Tomback to support the teachers in this county. I don’t give a hoot if it is the county council, the state of MD, or the President of the US…why isn’t Dr. Tombeck standing up and demanding funding for the very people who instruct the outstanding students in this county.
Where is the respect from our own boss? Where is his support? In my 20+ years of teaching in Harford County, I have never seen the morale so low in the schools, among all employees. In all of this mess, I have never heard one quote come from Dr. Tombeck that even remotely sounds like he cares about his staff. It just saddens me…
@unbelievableineveryway
The reign of entitlement government terror is ending. Welcome to the new normal.
Teachers need to get use to it or get out of teaching.
PORTER,
YOU ARE ON EVERY BLOG AND SAY THINGS THAT DO NOT EVEN MAKE SENSE. IF YOU HAVE NEVER BEEN A TEACHER GET OFF OF HERE, BECAUSE YOU DO NOT KNOW EVERY ISSUE THAT IS BEING DISCUSSED. YOUR INFORMATION IS ALWAYS DISTORTED AND YOU JUST LIKE TO GIVE YOUR NEGATIVE OPINIONS ON ANYTHING. YOU SPEND TOO MUCH TIME ON HERE AND I THINK EVERYONE IS TIRED OF YOUR BULLYING. GET A JOB BUT PLEASE NOT IN EDUCATION. UNTIL YOU HAVE WALKED IN A TEACHER’S SHOES- SHUT UP AND SUPPORT US!
Porter,
Before the grammar and spelling police get on here I meant off
Is there a Dr Tomback? During his tenure with HCPS I have seen him once and never heard him speak. He seems to avoid the public , speaks through spokespersons etc. Does he exist or is he the man behind the curtain?
Yes, but he wheels around town in a car, works out of his home office that was all negotiated and paid for by you the tax payer. Why would he be vocal for us b/c some how he receives his bonus pay every year. Sadly the whole process is getting old. Union negotiates with BOE who has nothing to do with funding, county council either doesn’t fund or if they do BOE spends money elsewhere. Bottom line is teachers are tired of being disrespected from all sides and that includes the leadership from the union who has majorly botched things this year and doesn’t articulate very well the actual issues. Instead of always harping on the pay increases why don’t they fight more for less duties, more planning time, class sizes, equity in preps and more vocal about how veteran teachers are being put on plans b/c all of a sudden they are not successful as a teacher.
As for all of you in the public who say teachers have it easy b/c we only work 10 months, 6 hours etc….I will gladly trade places with you for one week and let you experience the life of a teacher. Most of you would get a real culture shock. So please do us a favor and during American Education week please come visit the schools so you could get a feel for what we do.
I think the reason Tomback doesn’t come out in support of the teachers is because directing the community’s angst against the teachers makes him free to continue squandering the money the public invests in the schools. Seriously, why in the world during this economic crisis did he think it was beneficial to take an entourage to China?? What in the world was there to learn from a school system that exists to educate only the elite? How much tax money was wasted funding that trip and the substitutes paid to cover the admins on vacation? The newly created supervisor of middle school? What a waste of money!! All middle schools have principals supervising. There are curriculum supervisors for all subjects taught. What in the heck is a supervisor of middle school doing??? Supervising the supervisors?
NOBODY holds the Harford County administrators responsible for the misuse of school funds. What we expect the Board of Education to do is NOT being done.
The teachers are the backbone of a successful educational system. Good teachers will choose the neigboring districts that support the contract and pay better. They will stop coming to Harford County. After all, you get what you pay for.
Harford County teachers work hard and are dedicated to their students. It would be a dream to see Tomback and the Board dedicate themselves to the heart of the school system – the teachers.
I must say that I have never had any bad experience with Dr. Tomback , he has always made himself available to us , if we had any concerns or issues that we failed to get answers on , he is the one that steps up to the plate and answers or address our concerns .
Teachers acting like steelworkers, with national organizers sent in to promote rabble rousing. Implicitly threatening their product, which has been substandard for years. Meanwhile, San Jose and San Diego CA have sent a message that they can ignore at their own peril. I taught high school in my youth; the easiest job I’ve ever had and I was declared outstanding at it by my administration. I moved on because I needed more; I don’t want to be critical of those who don’t, but don’t expect assymetrical awards for doing it. Or, if you do and they don’t arrive, do something else.
@RobJam
Teachers are organizing students to be their pawns. Disgusting!
They feel disenfranchised and are listening to authority figures who have their own agendas; that’s normal. However, they need a reality check, not nice walks with their colleagues on a beautiful June day. Since, from the comments here, the vocal ones appear to live in a group think world that’s separate from the people who pay the taxes that fund their positions, that reality is going to be an abrupt life’s lesson. Again, if teaching under the conditions provided by Harford County is intolerable, then they have the same freedom of movement as the rest of the labor force.
@RobJam
Well stated.
rob jam
what is disenfranchised? did you mean disenchanted?
Excuse me… but are you a student?
Sorry that was directed at Porter
What is your evidence of this Porter?
[This reprise is for the teachers who missed my comment the first time]
@RobJam
Teachers are organizing students to be their pawns. Disgusting!
Repeating it will not be more popular the second time nor is it true!!!
“Taught high school in my youth”…how old are you, 98?
“Easiest job I’ve ever had”…either you really are 98 and taught in easier societal times or you’re just a damn liar.
I get it, you’re angry and frustrated. You’ve been led to believe you’re entitled to certain things because that’s how it’s always been. Bad parenting on the part of the school board and county government. However, I don’t know why you’d think that a personal attack would help you make your case. I taught algebra and geometry in a city school district in New York. I don’t believe the body of knowledge has expanded appreciably in those subjects, so I expect then would translate pretty well into today. I expect you’ll blame the parents; that today’s parents just don’t do their jobs. That’s independent from teachers doing their jobs. I put two kids through the public school system. It can be made to work just fine, but it must be manipulated from the outside to really work. That’s not a parent problem.
What is happening in this county? How could the BOE let the system get in this shape?
Brass would be retiring early if this were the military.
Because the people of this county elected the County Executive and County Council to do a job. If they don’t like the job they are doing then the voters need to speak. The reality is, other than some teachers, the voters are in agreement with their elected officials.
Yes the BOE is clueless , The teachers have their own cause , and so do we . We are fighting for annual Criminal Background checks to be done on everyone that comes in contact with our children at the schools they attend .If you were promised a increase you should get it, but something is brewing in the air which relates to the safety of our children . I was shocked at the amount of the BOE/SCHOOL workforce that has been charged with a criminal act , or who have done jail time , and somehow they are allowed in our classrooms ? Yes give the teachers what they were promised but give us a parents the peace of mind that our children are not in a classroom with a ex-con , Harford Watch Org numbers show 13% who are employeed by the school system have a criminal record .
@ Harford Watch Org – Post a link to your organiztions website. I want to access your site and check out your group. I need to see some real facts not just some blog post with a cute name.
I tried but could not locate a site.
We are a sub chapter of a national org , it’s not my fault if you do not know how to use a search engine , joking about that of course , I am a member , its a org that is and has been in good standing for over 100 years , you must be invited into , based on merit , good standing, and giving back . If you think about it for a moment it will become very clear to you who we are, and you will know then when we talk people listen and policy’s get changed . History has been changed because of us .
Koenig International World Watch News????
Really Jeff ?? Koenig , wow you are really out there . Next thing you will probably say/write is the CIA or NWO .
Made sense….I mean you claim to be part of a large influential organization. World Watch.org is the web site. With sub sites like jihad watch etc.
publicschoolreview.com/articles/108
It has only been 3 years with no step not 4.
We have already been told to not expect a step or raise next year. We can count.
Who told you this?
I believe it was Slutzky.
King David when he refused to fund the budget that was asked for to include teacher raises and steps.
Woods and Gutherie
It has been 4 years since we have had any step.
It has been 3 years.
Let us count together
09-10 10-11 and 11-12 = 3 years
12-13 has not arrived yet. When you get your pay in Sept. then we will agree.
It has been 4 years since we have had any steps.
I have lived in this county a couple decades and have never seen the educational situation this ugly. Shouldn’t someone put on their “Big Boy Pants” and bring this issue to a resolution quickly before next school year?
@Decoydude
We are in the midst of culture war of big government incompetence versus economic sensibility. Society cannot afford out-of-control government spending at taxpayer expense.
What the apparatchiks don’t understand is their rule is ending.
Porter consider that your property taxes have gone down and the budget has remained stagnet! All the while the county turnes in 100 Million in surplus funds over 5 years! You where screaming for the constant yield and now it seems you think that less than that is still too high for you.
@Cdev
Constant yield did not lower taxes for most taxpayers.
No but the last two years of charging less than the constant yield did!
@Cdev
You’re a tool.
People who have been in their homes for more than ten years did not have the real property taxes drop in most cases because of their Maryland Homestead Tax Credit.
CDEV;
I have tried to explain what the “constant yield” is for you. You continue to state pure nonsense about the use of constant yield at the County level. Your entire argument is nonsensical as a result of the flawed logic. Get it right or quit trying to use it, you obviously are incapable of understanding.
@Arturro
You’re my hero!
Tell me Porter…who did you vote for in the last gubernatorial election?
@Former HCPS Teacher
Who did you vote for in the last gubernatorial election?
Ehrlich…and do you always answer a question with a question without giving an answer to the original question?
No
And you still didn’t answer my original question you gutless turd. Whod did you vote for? I already know the answer…OweMalley…because now you’re too afraid to admit it and you’re stepping around the question. You know you’re a hypocritical ass because you’re on here rambling about government spending too much and it costing the taxpayers…when that’s what our governor has done ever since he took office…and we’re all paying the price for it now.
@FORMER HCPS TEACHER
Have you not been reading my posts?
Of course, I voted for Ehrlich!
I thought your question was some sort of unimaginative trap.
Amen Porter. People are really sick and tired of union types constantly wanting more more more. You all had my sympathy two weeks ago. But after seeing how some of you “educators” have acted on this site, you can all kiss off. No one has forced you to be a teacher. We are in dire economic times. If you dont like your pay find another job. You are all only making yourselves look like asses by your behavior.
A bunch of asses teaching your kids? You should really be concerned then.
Realist,
Yes, I was already quite concerned – enough to pull them from the public circus and send them to a private school where they get a really good education. Too bad more people can’t afford to do the same. We need vouchers desperately.
Alex R, While I don’t think I’d be able to pull your opinion, I do want to inform you what is happening to me as a current teacher.
I was hired after graduating in the Spring of 2009 to start in the fall. I was living the dream. I was returning to teach in the county that taught me everything I learned. It was rewarding to give back to a school system that had given me so much in my youth, and I hoped I could provide a positive impact to the students in my classes. When I was hired, I was given a payscale of the wages I would receive in years ahead. Honestly, I wasn’t paying the utmost attention to it, because it all seemed so surreal to me. I had gotten a job in my field right out of school, I couldn’t believe it!
Shortly afterwards, I bought a house in Forest Hill. It was a little pricey for the funds I was receiving at the time, but I had a roommate lined up to help out during that time. I figured by the time he moved out, I’d be sitting a little bit safer financially and everything would kinda fall into place.
Three years later, he has come and gone. He graduated and is now looking for his own place. Money is tight, but I do the best that I can. I’ve never been a frivolous spender: I still buy the cheapest foods and coupon clip with the best of them at Harvest Fare (my favorite grocery store!), I drive an old beat up Volvo with 220,000 miles (last year, the sunroof shattered, so I caulked a piece of plexiglass on it since it would have cost $900 to replace it, it’s ugly, but it gets me from point A to point B), I spend $12 a week in a bowling league, I don’t eat out very much at all, I don’t spend any money on cigarettes/lottery tickets/alcohol/other addictive money spenders, I just do what I have to. When BGE raises their rates, i feel it. When our health/dental increases, I feel it. When my trash collection/car insurance/basic cable bill comes in, I feel it. But I make it work, somehow, it seems to work.
The one thing I’m terrified for is grad school. Now that I’m entering my 4th year, I have to start taking classes to keep my teaching certificate active. Yes, Harford County does re-imburse some of the cost, but if I’m never making more than I am spending, I’ll never actually save enough to pay it off (with or without student loans). It’s getting tougher for everybody out there, we get that. But if it’s tough for me, an unmarried guy with no kids living alone with a paid off car, then I can’t imagine what some of my co-workers are going through. Yes, they might not be making $41,171 for the 4th year in a row next year. But it’s tough out there. They don’t have the deep roots growing up in Harford County like I do, they are here because it’s a teaching job. They can, and probably will, walk to another county because of the money.
It’s not in the cards for me to leave, I’ll go down with the sinking ship. I’ll still work with my after-school math program, and I’ll probably still manage swim meets during the high school competitions. I might even continue to throw my money into the union. But I’m not the one you should be worried about. I’m not the best thing since sliced bread, but I’m getting better everyday thanks to the other teachers around me that are. You might get angry seeing them with their signs and spreading their message even on these message boards, but they still come into work everyday and give it 100%. They are giving the education to your children that they are required to. No one is cutting corners, they just aren’t going to extra mile, and they won’t, for a school system that isn’t willing to do so for it’s teachers.
We understood (didn’t like to, but we did) when we didn’t have our contract honored two years ago. It took a while to swallow, but did it again last year. The screws are really tightening now, and those who have other options are taking them. We aren’t greedy trying to take more than we deserve, we only want part of what was promised. We accepted the contract not being honored twice in a row, anyone in the right situation can bend a little. Everyone also has a breaking point, and for many in the teaching profession, that time has come.
Peter,
Very well stated. I truly feel your pain. My wife is still with HCPS. I really feel bad for the teachers in your situation…single teachers with no family to support, who aren’t frivolous spenders, who STILL can barely make ends meet due to the situation with HCPS. That being said…I guarantee you…some of the jackasses on here will rip your comments apart…and it will all be petty stuff they pick on. I wish I could lay money on that bet…I could make up for my wife’s lack of step increases over the past 3 years on that one!
I would not go as far as to call anyone Asses, that is being a adult bully . I would be more concerned about the 13% of ex-cons or adults on probation that are admins, teachers, or any worker from the BOE that are in daily contact with our children . Background Checks every
school year should be done , delete the 13% of the bad workforce and there is the money to grant the step raises . Just a thought
@ Harford watch
deleting the person does not delete the position. Not to mention I doubt it is 13%. You suggest I go to MD case search to find the 13%. I know I appear there for one speeding ticket and I was sued for an automobile accident. Do you contend I should be fired?
Deal with it,
I hope you do not have kids because I feel sorry for them. The way you perceive teachers is so negative and distorted. If you do have children in HCPS schools don’t you want the best for your teachers that educate your kids. You make yourself look so ignorant because you have no idea how dedicated we are. We chose this profession because we love kids and want them to be the best they can be. Do you think we go to 4 years of college and then on to get Master’s degrees and worry about our salaries? It is because we love our profession and want to do the best for the future of our country.
You are probably a parent that calls and complains about a teacher and do not even know the teacher’s name!
Porter,
Please, please stop your comments about teachers! Are you a teacher? Stop worrying about us and concentrate on your own life and job. Nobody cares what you think especially because you hide behind a fake name which everyone knows!!! Good luck and hope you do not have any children because I feel sorry for them!!
Just sayin!
When was Magnolia Elementary in Abington?????
And not only did the HCEA get the location wrong, they spelled the wrong place incorrectly (It’s Abingdon, not Abington).
Yeah, that’s the kind of thing that really helps your cause as ‘educators of our children’.
“It was a little pricey for the funds I was receiving at the time” I feel no sympathy for you if you bought something you could not afford.
How is your post relevant to Cdev’s post????
Yeah those teachers they take up so much money, but JP Morgan blows 2 billion and no one complains. The private sector screws the economy up royally and what do they do blame teachers. Great lesson to teach your kids.
JP morgan is a private company into which people willing give them money with. Please stop comparing this to government and tax dollars.
Didn’t JP Morgan get a government bailout in 2008? Tax dollars, right? I wasn’t willing to give them my money, but they got it anyway.
Yep, I wasn’t willing to give them my money either. But Obama and Geithner led the way on it and we still have yet to see the Eric Holder Justice Department put much of anyone in jail. I know Bush et al also did the stimulus thing but Obama promised he would be different. He sure is different.
You mean like how people like to compare the public and private sectors on here?…sorry sweetness, you can’t have your cake and eat it too.
That was meant for Dealwithit
Wait I thought your kind wants government to be so much like the private sector?
Why of all public employees are teachers the poster child of waste?
The real meat and potatoes of the excess pay goes to people aside from teachers. Teachers are public fodder on a daily basis while there exists a segment of the population who are insulated from the goings on of the economy while collecting significant sums of federal, state, and local tax money.
We have to blame someone so let’s blame the first government employee we see or hear about.
It is assanine.
I agree that this is a sad situation. Teachers are visible therefore, they are an easy target.
Teachers deal with one particular segment of the population, the youth. Due to ineligibility, as such youth are a none voting, none vocal group, with absolutely no authority, nor control over government.
In addition, adults without children (currently enrolled in the public school system) many times do not feel they are adversely affected by the quality or lack thereof, of the education being administered to youth. The only direct effects easily recognizable are the costs in taxes. Therefore, many adults feel they have no vested interest.
What they may fail to realize is the long term negative effects that can be manifestated from a poorly educated society that they may be creating?
There is the possibility of a decrease in the qualtiy of life resulting from a lesser educated workforce. Just think in terms of simple services. …. Ex. the greeting a lack of civility and basic academic skill sets. There is a cost associate with shipping what one thinks is the right people in and out. I’m sure if, taxes are your problem you are surely against more low value housing and congestion.
What about the proliferation of drug use? A recent article illustrated the increase usage of heroin due the decline of the availability of certain prescription drugs? (this is not among a population one might stereotypically assume it to be either) Of course, there are a number of factors but, poor performing students in substandard educational environments are not the sole but, substantial breeding grounds for the behavior.
At least, even when one is miscreant in youth (hopefully this is the lesser percentage of students) when they come up in a good school system a percentage do recognize what they took for granted and have the ability to improve.
Harford County does have some of the top performing students in the nation and many goi to public shcools. That should not be dismissed. There was an article in this very paper recognizing a number of scholarship recipients a few months ago. Once, those academic achievers complete college you’ll want them to return to this community to raise their families. You’ll need GOOD TEACHERS to entice them. Now, of course you’ll need other attractions but, having good teachers and good schools is an essential part of the equation.
Therefore, the simplistic “times are tight” is not a sufficient way to deal with this situation. Things should not have been allowed to reach this point in the first place.
Teachers of which, I am not one represent a large part of OUR SENSE OF COMMUNITY and its identity. They should be given a bit more consideration and not be ostracized in such a cavalier manner.
Much of what is happening here is exemplified in much the same manner of the way situations are treated in inner city school systems. I am sure that is not what people want.
Oh they aren’t the only ones on the poster. It’s a really big poster and the HCPS administration is there along with a bunch of guys sitting in trucks and leaning on shovels to fix a little pot hole and GSA employees spending millions on a party and on and on and on. The difference is that when a private company wastes money it’s on them and their stockholders. When the public sector wastes it then it is on me. I guess I have higher standards and less tolerance when it comes to my wallet.
My point was to question why is there not an uproar on a daily basis over the phenomenal waste and overpayments happening elsewhere? The perceived high pay and benefits, not really, of teachers is negligible compared to the other things.
Yet, the rally cry is ‘screw the people in the trenches to save the economy’
It is a diversion of the highest magnitude from the crux of the problem.
Sorry that was at Porter
Races don’t need to be raised… Cut 100 positions and honor the freakin contract it’s simple math
Exactly what would teachers, parents, the politicians, and voters be willing to tolerate in reduced services to students? Is eliminating 100 teachers really what we want to happen?
@CLUELESS you are correct , take the 13% that works for the education system that fails a background check and trust me they will, Harford Watch has been looking into this , the board DOES NOT do annual checks, so if they start now, there will be more then enough money to grant the step increases , *no ex-cons , or current individuals on probation working with our children !!
Since I have been working at HCPS, they have done multiple background checks on current and prospective employees. They take your fingerprints and run them through the state and FBI. They are very costly, both in time and $$$. I doubt that there are any teachers who would fail.
@Ryan Burbey
You’d be surprised!
Show me the facts or crawl back under your rock.
Statistically in any population you will have felony and misdemeanor lawbreakers. To suggest that teachers as a cohort group can escape this immutable statistical fact is a absurd.
We certainly should check given the nature of HCPS employees work with children.
Porter – I would not argue on a statistical basis that something will turn up beyond divorce, traffic and civil. Turning up something is not 13%, or what is now claimed 22%. Search some names yourself and see if you come up with much more than divorces, liens, traffic violations or banal civil cases. Remember the claim is over 1 in 5 with serious criminal issues that warrant dismissal in his/her version of reality. About 1 in 4 in people the US have some sort of criminal record. Remember, our sample is not random nor is it representative of the entire population. Our sample is made up of college grads with “good” jobs that have already passed a criminal background check. If I were a betting person and I am not, I would be betting against Harford Watch Org on this one.
@Put Up or Shut Up
So, I guess you have no issue with HCPS doing background checks on personnel on an annual or biennial basis?
All in the spirit of putting up or shutting up!
@Porter- Your ideas sound a bit too progressive for my tastes. It does rub against my conservative/libertarian views. However, maybe at greater intervals than you suggest and phased in to apply to new employees unless the state passes a law making it mandatory in order to renew and hold a teaching license. The federal government should stay completley out of education. By doing it that way we can avoid taxpayer funding and have employees pay a small fee to cover it upon license renewal. However, I am still mostly opposed. If it makes you feel better, you, I and Harford Watch Org can get our backgrounds checked. I just recently got mine checked so I know that I am good, but I would do it again in the spirit of competition. I am even feeling charitable this evening and gave you a thumbs up.
@Robjam- My first two years teaching was similar to yours. But then the number of pointless meetings increased, then duties increased from 1-2 a week to almost every day for 40 minutes, then we had to start using performance matters printers for all benchmarks- with only 3 printers for 100+ teachers it’s a waste of the rest of our planning waiting for our turn. Before you mention we should print them out ahead of time: they aren’t available until maybe 2 days ahead of scheduled benchmarks. Then we are required to make phone calls home for students who have a ‘C’ or below in our classes- well with only 2 teacher phone lines that’s another time consuming task. From 7-7:30 we are required to stand in the hallway. Admins are in their offices sending and responding to emails teachers are expected to do prior to 7 a.m. The principal sits in his office and watches teachers on a huge flat screen tv from the cameras set up in the hallways. If he thinks a teacher isn’t dressed professionally enough he sends a mass threatening email to the entire staff. Today, I witnessed the principal almost yelling at one of our teachers infront of a bunch of students. He makes it known that if you don’t the rules he sets you can quit. But good luck transferring, he gives out a “cause for concern” or “unsatisfactory” observation for minor things he thinks we should have time to do- like incorporating a news article published the day before, or having a complete back up plan for the projector burning out mid class then a lesson for a overhead projector, and if that fails paper copies of the information.
So yes, it was a lot easier to be a teacher when we were actually allowed to be teachers and our time was respected. It’s completely different now.
I challenge you to substitute at a rt. 40 school and witness the teacher life now.
Which school? If true, this does not sound like the kind of leadership anyone would want in our schools. But if you want anything to be done about it you have to be more specific including names and dates.
What do you REALLY think would be done if that was revealed? Teachers here are intimidated and unless they were lucky enough to transfer or find another job no one will talk.
Try reading the “teacher protests across harford county” article. Which school am I photographed walking in to?
Funny that you would say how intimidated you are to reveal where you teach for fear of retaliation and yet you reference an article that leaves no question as to where you work.
Your principal is simply holding teachers accountable for doing their jobs. Perhaps this is a new and shocking idea for your school culture. Coming to work on time, staying all day, teaching with instructional integrity, and being asked to make instructional decisions based on student data are just a few of the things that we, as professionals, should be doing every single day. Don’t blame the administration of the school for being willing to provide help to those who are struggling or refusing to meet the expectations set out before them.
Are you serious? Maybe you are the one who is naive unless you are an employee there. Are you? If you are, come clean. What is the inside scoop about this guy?
How exactly will I be retaliated against? I simply meant if a teacher spoke up against anything we would have to reveal ourselves in order to file a complaint. Which no one is willing to do out of fear the year will be hell. I want admins to hold everyone accountable. But that’s not what is going on, there are ‘favorites,’ who can not follow rules but nothing is said to them. Every morning on the announcements students are insulted and belittled. Quarterly ineligible numbers have increased. Inservice days are poorly planned, if something goes wrong or isn’t working no backup plan is in place. Thank god I had my son before this admin, since the lactation room aka closet that had an outlet and privacy has been done away with- teachers can pump in the nurses office separated by a curtain from students. Better bring a cooler to store the bottles since we are suppose to use the faculty fridge- safe place to put breast milk? Do you go to the doctor everytime you’re sick? Well now we have to because doctor notes are required, which isn’t free.
As for data: should teachers with the best stats teach the higher level classes or lowest level? If almost all of my students score a 4-5 on the AP exam shouldn’t I be assigned to more or the same amount of AP classes?
In order to considered a ‘great teacher’ does that mean if they ask for input on a lesson they are now considered a cause for concern? By your response I assume you are one of the admins trying to justify the reason students and teachers dislike you.
If you come to work 40 minutes early, everyday but one day your car breaks down on the way- are you docked an hour pay for 1 minute late even though you had informed the office? Are teachers suppose to somehow prepare for every possible scenario? Guess I should have left an hour and half earlier so I could start walking?
Taxes*
For the life of me, I cannot understand how teachers are suddenly perceived in such a negative fashion. In America, as far as I know, if you don’t agree with something you are allowed to protest. That’s what I thought democracy was about.
I taught for five years, one and a half in private school where my starting salary with a four year degree was $26,000. I arrived at school, early in the morning, usually left in the dark, and often took papers home with me. The curriculum wasn’t well structured, so I was required to create a lot. Then there were faculty meetings, events, and other things.
I also taught in the city, Same deal except I was also buying breakfast food, school supplies, treats for the children and so on. I also had to worry about safety, as the neighborhood, was not a safe one.
The point I’m trying to make, is that people seem to think that teachers work only school hours, and have months to spend in the summer off. Some teachers do take off, many however work, as no salary is coming in.
In the office you have work as well, you have meetings, and you are probably also underpaid. But do have children knocking over desks, destroying your classroom, fighting? Do you have to make sure to have food on hand so children can eat, because they didn’t eat at home and were late for school? Do you have to look for bruises or make that call to child protective services, because what you just saw no one should have to? Is someone pressing you to make sure the test scores are met so your school isn’t failing.
Teaching isn’t about education anymore, it’s about producing a product. A child that will continue to produce good test results, so we can pat ourselves on the back and tell ourselves how well we did.
Teachers just want to be able to teach. To afford to do what they love, they want what everyone else wants. They are in the business of children. They business of molding, shaping, educating and producing our future.
In a society where we have given up on so much, I hope this is not a sign that we are now giving up on a future, and those who shape it.
What people fail to think about is what will happen to the children of Harford County when all of the successful teachers, who could easily get jobs in other counties that pay better and respect more, decide to leave. I am one of those teachers, who has never received an unsuccessful observation during 7 years of teaching primary students. All of my students are being promoted to the next grade on or above grade level in all subject areas. And I am leaving after next year. Citizens of Harford County might want to consider who will be responsible for teaching their children to read, add, and write. And if they want substandard teachers doing it, then they can continue to support a County Council that does not value education. Good luck in the future.
“…all of the successful teachers, who could easily get jobs in other counties that pay better and respect more, decide to leave…”
So all of you could up and leave at once, cross a county line, and get better pay with more respect? The grass is always greener… Don’t be fooled by salaries in other counties, the entire financial system across all governments in this country is about to implode, that is why we have asinine officials such as Governor O’Malley raising taxes and fees at an unprecedented level; because they do not know to tighten a belt, like Harford County has actually done. I’m sorry to say it, because I do feel that most of you do great job, but times are tight, unemployment is sky high, both private sector and other government agencies alike have had to cut jobs, so what did you really think would happen? Welcome to tough economic times, just like the rest of us who are overworked and underpaid.
Most teachers can’t leave and most won’t.
Yours is an empty threat!
P.S. Best of luck to you in your new endeavors elsewhere
@Porter
“an empty threat”????? I can only hope that you are not the fool you appear to be. You have no idea what you are talking about. In my high school there are 5 from one department alone leaving. We have around 20 teachers leaving and many of them are excellent, well seasoned teachers who are CHOOSING to leave. I was raised here, graduated from BAHS and have taught in the same community for 18 years but it might be time to move on now, and that hurts, but it is real. You are a fool to think that teachers will not leave. “Most teachers can’t”…lol. Keep believing that.
@Worktorule
We’ll have to wait and see who is right.
Teachers are like most people they don’t do things that take them out of their comfort zone. Relocating to for a similar teaching position for a few dollars more or commuting 60-100 miles round trip per day are not actions most teachers are willing to take.
So go back to polishing your pitchfork and make some nice dinner plans for after your next attack on the Bastille.
P.S. Long live the great benevolent Governor Scott Walker! May his leadership and policies infect Maryland.
Pitchforks are all polished, and I will be having lobster. Your world view is myiopic and warped by the tinted shades you wear my man.
@Worktorule
I wish all the suffering private sector workers and those taxpayers without jobs could have lobster.
I will pray for those people who are less fortunate than our blessed Harford County teachers so maybe they too can afford lobster.
First of all it was a joke response to your stupid comment…lol, second you do know that a lobster at shoprite is only $6.99 or so usually and any private or public sector moron could have it in place of their meal deal at McDonald’s any day they want.
@Worktorule
You’re significantly smarter than me as you’ve obviously demonstrated by your posts.
I’m a student of life and just trying to learn from you…
P.S. Do you think McDonald’s will ever sell lobster?
McD’s does in some areas actually.
Actually McDonald’s in the New England states and Canada already does sell Lobster Rolls…McDonald’s has been selling lobster rolls for years and they’ve always been made with real lobster.
If you can afford lobster, what are you complaining about?
You cal $10,000 more a few dollars more?
@Cdev
Yes $10K is a few dollars more relative to the cost of relocating (not to mention differences in cost-of-living) and the cost of commuting say 100 miles round-trip a day for 180 days at $0.55 per mile.
You do the math.
Porter no relocation is required for this money. You can teach at Kenwood, Middle River, Essex, Dundalk, The Zone, Perryville, Perry Hall, Kingsville, Elkton and not have a problem at all for this few dollars as you call it. BTW if 10K is a small amount to you can I have a little bit of money?
Wow! You really are unaware of what is going on. I left this county two years ago and am making seven thousand dollars more! That is a whole lot more that your saying “…leaving for a few dollars more”. Not only am I making much more but I also have a wonderful administration that actually respects the veteran teacher! Don’t wish for “Gov. Walker” here in Maryland. Talk about a slap to the public service employee! You are wishing for dangerous things!
Porter – we share some of the same views, maybe we should meet , I then can explain Harford Watch Org to you , just a thought . I extend a invite to you .
Won’t that be cozy.
Invite only sorry Ms or Mr put up or shut up
If I bring my super secret decoder ring can I come too?
Don’t be disappointed, cape and cowl are optional.
There is nothing more disturbing than a super secret society that no one has ever heard of starting to make themselves known on a local forum for an online news site. I suggest you either demonstrate legitimacy or just fade into the woodwork. Use a real name, establish some credibility beyond your assertions that you know something we don’t know (Looney Tunes reference there) or just plain shove off into the obscurity that you deserve.
Can we have a date maybe for Harford Watches big release? Other wise I call ishtar and think you are out to slander teachers!!!!
We are a sub-org , the Maryland main chapter office in Balt, and yes there is one in DC as well , Truth be told we work hand in hand with State and Federal orgs, maybe I am a plant , maybe I am not , but as it was stated before this has been going on for months , Harford was not even on the radar for Annual Background Checks till this started . I was content researching the other county I was assigned to , but I was handed this because this is in my how would you put it – My own back yard . For those that doubt , they will be the ones to live without .
I have an aluminum foil pirate hat. Can I join your sub org to this shadowy unnamed influential world wide organization?
Some interesting clues we know so far about Harford Watch Org from reading his/her posts: plant or maybe not, assigned by his organization to investigate teachers but only in Harford when teachers stood up and worked to rule, won’t name names or group affiliation, can only join his organization by invitation only, claims to meet with the HCPS leader who he likes, claims 22% Harford teachers are/were criminals, works with government officials hand in hand, thinks like Porter and defends Cathy. Maybe an ultra wingnut type working for a corporate lobbyist with ties to the American Legislative Exchange Council aka ALEC or similar group? Maybe just another pretender with an agenda posting on this site. Who knows, but he certainly is entertaining as all heck. This is like Enemy of the State or Watergate. Just a bit creepy.
So when teachers staarted working to the rule….than you got concerned about their backgrounds????? You want the federal govt to regulate how individual school districts back ground check? Talk about holy unfunded mandates!!!! Sounds very big government thinking. to big government to be conservative.
Yes I want to cut 100 positions… There are dozens of “fluff” positions that do NOTHING that can go first… 3 guidance counselors. Unnecessary, mentors (they do nothing but eat at their desk and makes end emails), Insructional facilitators 100k for nothing, that’s just the tip of the sword. Tough decisions need to be made if the board won’t do it I will.
It would be interesting to get an employee roster which shows each position in the school system, how many people are employeed in that position, and the total annual salaries for each position. I would not be surprised to find that 20% of the money is being spent on fluff jobs which have little to do with actually teaching or maintaining the buildings.
There’s a position entitled with the Harford County Schools “Director of Community Engagement, Equity and Cultural Proficiency” – position created in 2010. The initial pay rate was $124,841.00…you know it’s higher now. Don’t know about you but I’m feeling all warm and fuzzy just knowing we have somebody guarding our cultural proficiency. Shame I can’t find a way to patch a little roll eyes here.
I’m rolling my eyes right with you. I work in a school that could seriously use his help (as stated in his job description), but I have never seen him visit classrooms (let alone the building!), speak to the staff, or offer any support to the administration. I seriously don’t know what he does besides make presentations. Does anyone know of anything significant he has done this year? If not, why is he making so much money? And what do we do about it? It really pisses me off!
Start by Maryland Case Search, put a few names in there , Vice Principals, Principals, Teachers, any and everyone from the top to the bottom , even the Janitors , there will be a min of 13% , there is your cuts and your money to give the step increase . You will be shocked , I can not understand why the BOE would hire or keep any employee with such records !! PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE
You do realize that all teachers submit to a background check, both state and FBI, when they are hired.
@RYAN BURBEY, you are correct BUT IT IS NOT DONE ON A YEARLY BASIS, do not judge our finding till you look into this matter yourself, again it is public knowledge
It cost me $10 when I was hired. So $10 x 5,000 employees = $50,000 each year. Don’t you think the money would be better spent elsewhere?
Background checks are not costly at all, I guess you are not aware of todays technology . Print and background check can be completed all within a matter of minutes , then it goes into the system and low and behold , there are your results , not costly at all . Thank God for record keeping if not there would be some items missing from each and every classroom and office this morning lol . I will say this , that Harford County Liquior Board can verify that we are a real org , The BOE can confirm it as well . Words of Wisdom DON’T DO SOMETHING PERMANENTLY STUPID BECAUSE YOU ARE TEMPORARILY UPSET .
You have been asked repeatedly to demonstrate that you are legitimate. Do not even think that by citing another agency or entity that it removes you from a question of credibility. You, at this point in time, are nothing more than an unknown poster on a local news forum. And it appears your evasion is covering up a fraud.
Demonstrate your legitimacy. Or continue to have your intentions and validity questioned.
They might be cut but then will be replaced. Money will not be saved.
I day give them the raise, but, like ALL OTHER County employees make them submit to mandatory drug testing. You’d thin the ranks very quickly.
I doubt it. Teachers are too traditional. Don’t come up with any more ideas that would waste tax dollars.
Who is going to pay for the tests and how much will that cost? I actually think you will not find much objection to the idea from most teachers except that it is a waste of money that could be better spent on othher things!
SOunds to me like you dont want drug tests because you would fail
Nah, After I rescued Brooke Shields and had a party I was thinking about an influential person in my life named Mr. Hand and he convinced me to get my life together. I don’t touch the stuff!
LOL!!!
The County would SAVE so MUCH MONEY if they did annual BACKGROUND CHECKS and DRUG TESTING, because of the fact 13% or more would be fired as a result of these screenings , THE CAN OF THE WORMS HAS BEEN OPENED , expect something added to the contract in exchange for the step increase , JUST FYI – BTW since this is out in the open , I was just informed the numbers have increased from 13% to a wopping 22% and that is on the background checks alone , that does not even include any future results for drug testing .
Need I say more.
We are all powerful and will investigate everyone. You will see. By the way, we will have to work fast because the world is ending in December.
If you want to jump on the end of the world 2012 band wagon, I pray you are not a teacher saying this to kids .
@harford watch org – I should have known that you couldn’t understand that I was being sarcastic. I will try to keep it less complex next time.
Harford Watch and Super Secret – NEO PHA?
@FERGISON , maybe you are right, but the easier and simple way is MARYLAND CASE SEARCH , Harford Watch has come across many, here is one for you a VP that has has a last name change 3 times but has a long and current criminal history including Child Abduction !! Has that for a surprise .
Since these public facts are part of the public court records and quite newsworthy, you are not held liable if you disclose them(Cox Broadcasting vs Cohen 1975). Therefore, publish them on your website or give them to a news organization. They better not be traffic violations, divorces or code violations.
Our findings will be presented to the BOE and at State level and National level at the same time it will be published and I am sure your local news or newspaper will report the findings . Harford County is not the only county with this problem , Maryland is not the only state with this problem , just fyi , unfortunately this investigation has been in the works for some time , but Harford has moved to the Top of the List since the spotlight was turned on .
Bring it on….and I am telling you right now your cause will be laughed at and thrown out if you bring any type of civil, divorce, or traffic violations to the board. I have a better idea. Why don’t we list and publish all the violations of parents of students in this county. I know for a fact that would bring about a lot of parents being banned from schools.
Everybody is paying more out of pocket now days to keep a job. So go boo hoo someplace else please teachers. Politicians gave away the farm years ago – let anybody have a house – whether they could afford it or not. Let oil be traded as a commodity, forget about speculators ramping up prices. Call in loan time – nobody can pay back. Bam – busted economy. At the fed level – we have a 5 year pay freeze going on and are preparing to “contribute” more for health and retirement. My job is just as “noble” as educating the young, so HCPS unions – get in line with the rest of us.
My sister works for the FEDS and their is NO freeze. She just recently got a monetary reward for doing a good job for the job she is paid for. And, she NEVER stepped foot in a college.
The college point is pointless. There are plenty of good workers who did not go to college.
A cash award probably was $50-100. And I guarantee she did not have a raise. There is a federally mandated 2 year pay freeze. It is now most likely going to be extended another 1-3 years.
Simply put, you are wrong.
I can beat it with anecdotal as well as real numbers.
The anecdotal:
Most of the people I work around received $2000.00 bonuses just for breathing. I can’t reveal where I work as I work with some vindictive people.
The numbers:
google this
data universe federal 2011
click the federal employees link under The Asbury Park Press
or
http://php.app. # com/fed_employees10/search.php
remove the # from above link after paste into browser
under the location tab select Maryland, Baltimore City for location.
choose something like Veterans department or National institue of health, they have people in baltimore.
Aberdeen will have limited availability as it is defense related.
repeat for previous years and compare side by side
sort by category tabs as you wish, in particular bonuses
or narrow by
Simply put, you are wrong.
I can beat it with anecdotal as well as real numbers.
The anecdotal:
Most of the people I work around received $2000.00 bonuses just for breathing. I can’t reveal where I work as I work with some vindictive people.
The numbers:
google this
data universe federal 2011
click the federal employees link under The Asbury Park Press
or
php.app. # com/fed_employees10/search.php
remove the # from above link after paste into browser
under the location tab select Maryland, Baltimore City for location.
choose something like Veterans department or National institue of health, they have people in baltimore.
Aberdeen will have limited availability as it is defense related.
repeat for previous years and compare side by side
sort by category tabs as you wish, in particular bonuses
or narrow by
It is not pointless because she has no student loan debt and makes more than me. Her award was $500.00, she gets an assload of leave. She takes off from November to January because of use or lose, therefore she is a 10-month employee. She makes time and a half for more than 40. She has unlimited smoke breaks too. If there is a freeze now there has not been for the last 3 years and certainly not 4, as you stated. The federal government has a deficit, HCPS has 100 million in the bank.
Federal pay freeze means no COLAs, but steps and merit-based promotions are still occuring. Some organizations are overstaffed and not doing promotions until they get under their allocations, while others organizations (BRACed ones) are filling empty seats as fast as possible to get back to full capability.
If all these teachers want to do is teach with a little more freedom, then why is the focus of most of their complaints on pay? I have read many of the comments and many of the teachers are threating that our childrens future is at stake. . WOW is all I can say. This behavior has been used for decades and is worn out. It is counderproductive to your cause to hold our children hostage, so to speak. We understand the system you work in is a government run entity, thus it was set up for failure, but do not implement scare tactics on our children. Many of your comments have stated puzzlement to the current change to the sentiment of taxpayes toward public school teachers. The answer is simple, folks are struggling to pay bills and barely maintaining jobs, industries and businesses are shutting down, yet we have teachers and unions using our children as pawns for their greed.
Let me ask you …..
Teachers do you not recieve discounts and benefit packages that are comparable to military and police? Is your yearly pay only based on a nine or ten month schedule? Are you not considered a public servant? As a public servant you may have to sacrifice from time to time. When our taxpayers are feeling the crunch, you may be called upon to sacrfice some of your pay. These sacrifices are small in comparison to military and police. And small in comparison to what many taxpayers are experiencing in the extremely uncertain and violtile private sector. If you can not handle being a public servant, then please feel free to enter the privat sector, or seek some other form of employment.
I respect teachers and appreciate the job they do teaching our youth but it appears they, like many in the public sector, have lost sight of what public service is all about. I do not believe that there is to much asked of teachers. Youe blessed with insane job security, and get to go home every night and hug your loved ones. You do not face life ending danger on a routine basis. You do not face long deployments, nor are you subjected to dealing with low life criminals. Many complaints voice the extra demands placed on you. Such is life and the extra demands I read here pale in the face of what I see in other areas of service. You may want to ask yourself if the rewards of your job, and the pride of your work is not enough to get you through?
My point is that you need to count your blessings and ride this out during our countries time of weakness. Serve your country and stop sniveling about it. Look around you, there are probably many teachers who valiently do just that. Good luck to you all, I sincerely hope that thigs work out for the best, whatever that may be.
Why do you feel that teachers should ride this out but not the politicians and higher ups at the BOE? They have not relinquished any of their perks. As far as danger goes, we break up fights and are threatened by angry parents and their children. I do not go home and hug my children, I go home and grade paper and plan lessons because HCPS gives Us 45 minutes to do this aNd it is impossible. I
“during our countries time of weakness”
The country is not weak and Harford County’s economy is fine. Try your tired thoughtless argument elsewhere.
Harford County is in fairly decent shape, due to a relatively fiscally responsible local government. Take a real good look around, Phil. The country is in the midst of the worst economic times since the 1930’s. Budget tightening is what is going on in Harford, lay-offs and major tax increases are rampant everywhere else.
Work at Alt. Ed. You are dealing with low life criminals and risk your life on days
Louis,
Let me address a few points you made:
“I do not believe that there is to much asked of teachers.”…Well, then you obviously aren’t related to one.
“Youe blessed with insane job security”…not in THIS HCPS…no sir…this HCPS is a witch hunt which began with Jackie Hass (good riddance you waste of life) and has continued with Baltimore County Bob
“nor are you subjected to dealing with low life criminals.”…try teaching in Baltimore City where I began my career. You face more up in your face disprespect there than you do as a police officer…with no power to do anything about it. Many complaints voice the extra demands placed on you.
“You may want to ask yourself if the rewards of your job, and the pride of your work is not enough to get you through?”…sorry, last time I asked, my mortgage company wouldn’t let us pay our mortgage with the rewards of my wife’s job
“My point is that you need to count your blessings and ride this out during our countries time of weakness.”…if weakness is a county sitting on a $90 million surplus, then yes, Harford County is very weak.
Former HCPS Teacher, to refer to Jackie Haas as a waste of life is a horrible and incorrect statement. I don’t know what she ever did to you, but you need to develop civility, as well as learning facts about her. To me, only a low class slime ball would write such a thing and I am glad that you are a former HC teacher.
I liked Jackie Haas. She intervened when Nancy Reynolds was going all power crazy and when Benedetto thought he was chief of security. Too bad neither of them could tell me where my son was on a snow day. I was banned from the Middle School because I questioned Nancy’s competence, Jackie got me put back in after Nancy lied her withered butt off in the presence of Benedetto. And then Benedetto suggested that future help from the staff in locating my child was dependent on my demeanor. Boy I’m glad my son is not dependent on their concept of safety and security. That was the year I bought him a cellphone.
Louis Braddy who should be Mr. Brady. This is not the Brady Bunch or Leave It To Beaver. Fiscal conservatives are not Communists. You work to earn money to support your family and create wealth. Teachers should not be excluded from this system afterall this is America. I support teachers looking after themselves and speaking up. I they had a contract it shoud be honored. Maybe we should make everyone pay to send their kids to school and those of us who don’t have any kids can get most of our tax dollars back. Maybe we could just pay a base fee for upkeep. If you pay for it directly, I think you appreciate it more. Your education is an investment and there is a direct correlation between the quality of the investment and the return that you will receive. In our economy only the strong and competitive will survive and prosper.
Teachers are NOT public servants. Teachers do NOT get discounts, etc. due to their job. Teachers are not focusing on pay…they are focusing on a contract that has been ignored for years. That is just plain wrong.
After what happened in Wisconsin, look for more reigning in of the teachers’ unions. We, the people, are tired of ever-increasing taxes to fund the salaries, healthcare and pensions of these people that we will never be able to achieve or even worse when one is on a fixed income like the seniors. In many cases, the kids are coming out of school not ready for college or the workforce and have to take remedial courses. Bad teachers cannot be fired because of unions, and good teachers cannot be rewarded.
This is a fight that is going to reverberate in many of the states that are facing billions of dollars in unfunded pensions and healthcare benefits. PA is even talking about changing their state constitution to stop this madness.
I believe in a fair wage for services performed, but the public employee unions have gone way overboard. In Wisconsin the average salary and benefits for public workers is $81,000 and the private average is $67,000. Here in PA the average teacher’s salary is $80,000 in one school district. However since that law was passed in Wisconsin union membership has dropped from 60,000 to 28,000. Now they don’t have to pay union dues any longer.
You can only push citizens so far before they start fighting back. After Wisconsin, look what happened in San Diego and San Joe, both in a democratic state.
“In many cases, the kids are coming out of school not ready for college or the workforce and have to take remedial courses.”
That is a systemic issue not a teacher issue.
Cathy – when comparing the salaries of government workers to private sector workers, did you take into consideration the education levels of those employees? How many of each group have bachelor’s degrees, masters, of PhD’s?. If a government worker is a more educated in general, that may contribute to the pay differences.
Cathy,
“We, the people, are tired of ever-increasing taxes to fund the salaries, healthcare and pensions of these people”…I can’t speak for PA because I live in MD…however, in MD, income taxes will be going up (for some people) due to the governor but it certainly isn’t to pay for teacher raises…and in Harford County, real estate taxes have gone DOWN.
“In many cases, the kids are coming out of school not ready for college or the workforce and have to take remedial courses.”…you are very right in that some students come out of school unprepared. That’s not the teachers’ fault…you can only lead a horse to water. When you have a student and parent who don’t value education, the end result is going to be bad no matter how good a teacher you have. I have former students who didn’t pay a damn bit of attention in school and their parents didn’t care what they did. What do some of those kids do now (and yes I know this for a fact because I still keep in touch with some of them) for a living? Either collect welfare or bounce around from menial job to menial job…because they didn’t think paying attention in school mattered and neither did their parents.
“Bad teachers cannot be fired because of unions”…completely untrue…I’ve known several very good teachers that have been let go because of administration not liking them and making life hell for them…putting them on cause and concern and even lying about them to the superintendant. Yes, it’s harder to get rid of a tenured teacher (which has nothing to do with being in a union…non union teachers can be tenured too)…but it can and is done.
“Here in PA the average teacher’s salary is $80,000 in one school district.”…I call bullcrap on this one. What school district? Where did you get those numbers from? And don’t include administrators salaries in with actual teachers…administrators are so far removed from the educational process it’s a joke.
“You can only push citizens so far before they start fighting back.”…You’re exactly right…and teachers are citizens too…and now they’re fighting back.
Cathy -You moved to PA so stay out of our business. You have no standing in our county anymore. This is our issue, and we will resolve it. I resent outside interference. Go find a PA blog or move to Wisconsin and blog there.
Again, she has a right to speak , Just like I have a right and so does the local sub chapter and the national chapter . See the funds trinkle down from the top, DC,STATE,COUNTY – she pays taxes in the USA – she has a right to be heard .
The word you are looking for is trickle.
Cathy you left….You don’t count….in the words of some on here…..Go Pound Sand!
Cathy has a right to let her voice to be heard just like everyone else .
Yes she sure does and we all have the duty to ignore her opinion since she is not a resident of Harford County, MD and is not a taxpayer here.
The federal workers for the most part do not sincerely earn their pay. If you believe that then you have never worked around them and only get a one sided story from the union types. Its a joke how little of a demand is placed on federal workers. Ive seen some of the worst workers of my life in federal service recieving GS-12 and GS-13 pay. You do not know what you speak of. Cathy is dead on. The federal level is so egregious its criminal, but we are not talking about federal workers when speaking about teaching. Teaching is, and ALWAYS should be, a state issue.
Name names Louis. I work at Aberdeen Test Center. Your comments are insulting to the many good people I work with who have a definitive attitude of excellence and perform hard work. There certainly is mediocrity present in the workforce, but by and large the people I work with all impress me with their execution of difficult tasks, their desire to provide the customer with outstanding support all while maintaining a watchful eye on government resources that are provided by the tax payer. So while you were there observing these failures did you actually say anything about the substandard performance? Or did you do what other federal workers do (the ones you impugn in your commentary) and simply go along to get along? I regularly thank people I work with for their support – especially when they exceed my expectations. And when others let me down, I let them know. It’s not universally appreciated, but it should be the standard for work anywhere.
Find your names here:
php.app. # com/fed_employees10/search.php
remove the # from above link after paste into browser
I work with too many petty vindictive people and would pay a price for putting a direct name on here. I’ve pushed that envelope regarding waste enough times already.
Sounds like your management is comatose and vindictive. Perhaps one of the posters here has a solution to the problem… you can vote with your feet and try another locale. I did when I moved here, but that was because I found myself working for government employees that regarded us as a means to a self esteem boost. And there is absolutely nothing as brilliant as the notion that contractors are interested in profit only. When I think of the TFX decision that gave us the General Dynamics F-111 (Despite Boeing having a record of on time under budget and superior technology) and the good folks that over ruled their contractor lackeys to allow Challenger to Launch and Columbia to re-enter without a visual check on it’s structure (for cost and schedule reasons). I came here to be able to spend more time off with my son. I still do a good job to the extent that my management will allow me. And when I suggested a few years ago to my boss that the primary purpose of management is to enable their people to perform work, he looked at me and told my expectations of management were unrealistic. So yes there are jerks in federal employee that rationalize the inefficiencies of the system. But the ones that do a great job are the ones that rise above the nonsense and do the right thing. Ask me sometime about government ethics training.
As a contractor(although essentially a non-tenured underpaid fed), I take the same ethics training. The training and its implementation/enforcement leave much to be desired.
I’ve been looking to move with my feet and will when I find something that will be more than a lateral shift in terms of atmosphere.
The purpose of management is to bask in the glory of the underlings who after all would themselves be management if not for their lack of abilities…
“Know your place.”
“Not my problem.”
“We don’t do that here.”
“{Budgetary concerns are not ours to manage, we just spend the money.”
“It’s my money to do with as I see fit.”
I’ve heard a lot of variations on the same theme.
Ethics training. My point is ethics training tells you what you are not supposed to do in an effort to bring shame down upon the sacred trust of being a public servant. I have argued with a contract specialist about the welfare check she gave to a garage in New Jersey that dropped shipped legitimate sole source gages to ATC and received an additional $852 for the service. All because they rung a few bells for small business set aside. I told the specialist I would not be comfortable having my name associated with the solicitation in the news. She didn’t get it because of her interpretation of policy. The person she went to was neither an authorized distributor or a legitimate competitor and his bid should have been regarded as non responsive since he was only drop shipping for his welfare he got from the government. There are plenty of things done in the name of the United States Government by people that interpret policy to be on their side. Therefore, because they do it… it is ethical.
Porter, Aberdeen Test Center, is this siesta, er, I mean CSTA?
Yes it is…. anything else funny to say? Come on… you know it’s in you… let’s go there…. be that guy I know you are. Make a funny remark about a place that you know little about or that you find somehow less than awe inspiring because you are not so easily amused as to fail to let your superior intellect and wit come through on this. It’s a place you can go off topic to comment on something that is not related to the discussion up until this point in time. Do it. Then tell us the stellar organization you work for so creeps similar to you can come out from under a rock and say something pithy that tickles their low esteem.
Aw, Porter, Did I hit a nerve. You hit people’s nerves all of the time. It doesn’t seem to bother you.
Tell me your real name and where you work you timid little creep.
Stay classy, David A. Porter!
I mostly am around GS-11 and GS-12 with a few higher throughout the week.
One person out of three will actually be doing a satisfactory or better job.
You are correct, it is a joke.
High pay, low responsibility, no accountability.
I haven’t had a pay increase in the last 4 years either and actually took a 5000.00 a year pay cut. I do things like scrapping to make up the difference. I know they educate our kids, but man do they realize there isn’t any money. They know going into this profession that they were not going to get rich doing it. Maybe they need to renegotiate their deal. Cut some of the benefits in a trade for pay. Just my thoughts.
The problem is that there is money………..last year Harford County reported a $97 million overestimation of expenditures and moved that money to their fund balance!!
It is really getting old hearing from teachers about how much money the county has. Do you all know why the county has some cash reserves? Because they have tightened up; they have been looking ahead to worse economic times. Most of you are so far to the left, that you actually believe our current President and Governor’s rhetoric about how things are getting better, well, don’t believe it, they both suck at budget balancing and they both are running for president, one as an incumbent this year, and the other to take his place in 4. Harford County is going to be able to weather what lies ahead better than many other local governments, because they have tightened up. I’m sorry you all feel overworked and underpaid, but don’t go pointing to an account of public funds claiming that it is yours, simply because you work hard. Most of work hard, really hard, and it is also our hard earned tax dollars that you are pointing to! If we could hand you all raises and get some our tax money back, we would, but that is not realistic! Now go work to your contract, and enjoy your upcoming 8 week vacation, while the rest of us continue filling up the coffers you keep pointing to.
You think we’re all left leaning Democrats? You might learn a few things about the teacher ranks before saying such things… just saying. I might be a bit more conservative than you – the old style, not the current ideology being passed off as conservatism either.
First, we’re tax payers, too. Second, I spend my vacation doing another job – what do you do and where do you go on vacation? Tightening belts? Listen, I feel like I have a second master’s degree in belt tightening.
Are you at all upset that your county officials are behaving dishonestly?
1) “You think we’re all left leaning Democrats?”
I said “most of you”
2) I am well aware that teachers pay taxes.
3) I work in the private non-profit sector as a social worker of sorts, I work a very stressful job dealing with people in crisis situations day in and day out including teachers and the loved ones of teachers, and I do this for below average pay, I work evenings weekends and all summer long, my benefits package is no where near as nice as HCPS teachers, and if we are lucky, my family might make it to Maryland’s Eastern Shore for a long weekend vacation this summer. My wife works for a neighboring county government, and her job may or may not be there at the end of this fiscal year.
What good does it do to privatize wealth at the expense of others? We were told a long time ago that the surplus was our money, and it sold a lot of people who wanted to believe that the National Debt was not our collective debt. You can save a lot of money for a rainy day if you choose to ignore your obligations and reduce your services. Pay the pension costs… money does not fall from the sky. You will pay for it one way or another. And I will trade you one F-35A for the $72 million less we borrow from the Chinese.
Really,
We do not get 8 weeks vacation. Please find out the facts before you post. Teachers DO NOT GET PAID IN JULY OR AUGUST!!!
We work to a contract for 190 days and that is all. We have worked 4 years without our step increases which affects our retirement. You obviously have no idea about teachers and I would probably guess you are a parent that blames everthing on the teacher and not your perfect child. Wake up and support the teachers.
Brian, I do not expect to become rich from this occupation. That is not the point. The point is that the county lies when it says it cannot honor a contract. If the county is willing to lie and fight to defend that lie (spending your tax money doing so) – when does that stop?
It does sound like you have your hands full. You have my sympathy. You would have more of it if I learned that your employer entered an agreement to provide you monetary relief and then cried poverty – while sitting on a huge surplus.
The people on this forum who hate teachers and public servants tell us to find different work or suck it up. I could tell you the same. I won’t, however, because I understand your position very well. You are out $5K a year – I’m out $10K. I want it better for both of us. I’m sure you work hard and deserve it.
As for re-negoatiating the deal – we did. The county did so in bad faith. That’s the whole point of this.
We did renegotiate the deal. We got offered two steps and 3%. We accepted it then the county reneged. Now they refuse to talk.
@Brian , there should be no cuts, there should be a set of standards, ANNUAL BACKGROUND CHECKS, AND DRUG TESTING , This should be state wide from the top to the bottom for all that work with our children, they only do background checks when first hired , our org has researched and what started at 13% has jumped to the high 20% mark . We want do not want our children taught by anyone in the education system that has a serious criminal record , it is public knowledge , we were working on other counties and other states but with Harford in the spotlight they moved to the top, we are shocked at are findings . Some of them should not even be around are children . Trust me this will be a new policy very very soon, and when the bad one’s are gone there is the money to give them for their step increases. HARFORD WATCH ORG LOCAL CHAPTER , and we are not talking parking tickets or divorces either .
Watch,
Share a link to your organization. I work for HCPS and have no objection to random drug testing or annual background checks. Just wondering who will foot the bill for that in these lean times, but anyway… I would like to see the facts behind the 20% you are reporting.
Again as I stated , we are a sub chapter of a nat org, we have been around for over 100 years . In fact we started the Annual Background Check rule due to what happened in another state , but with Harford in the spotligt we were asked to look into this . If you think about it , you know who we are , it is a org that you are invited into, based on merit, giving back etc . I will not show our cards by stating the national name of our org before we go to DC and yes we have a appointment in DC about this . We want the Annual Background check done nation wide . Our finding will be published on the national level and on the state level . We have helped change old laws and created new ones, see the difference here is HOW YOU GO ABOUT WHAT YOU WANT CHANGED . Most of the teachers on here , have actually mentioned the name of our national – world wide org in your classrooms ,by now there should be a light bulb going off in your head of who we are, if so then you know we will have no problem getting the Annual Background Check and Drug testing law to pass , we are actually thinking about calling it the HARFORD LAW , that would be nice wouldn’t it ? A National Law name after this county huh ?
Since you are so busy looking into the backgrounds of other people, why don’t you do the honorable thing and tell us who you are? Then maybe we can assess the source ourselves.
He can’t because he is full of it.
Illuminati?
YOU HAVE ASKED FOR ME TO EXPLAIN WHO WE ARE . Here is something for you to read publicschoolreview.com/articles/108
Harford Watch Org [or Patrick’s other ego]… oh my.
A three year-old article discussing investigations another party made into peoples’ lives. Third hand accusations?
For kicks I searched for how this contract dispute popped up on your radar… You do recognize that it has not harnessed a single mention outside the Baltimore area? Yet, you were put on the ‘story’ by your superiors because it was in your ‘back yard.’ BS.
I will say this… you are fun to have around for the laughs you provide.
One more thing… do you have a shoe phone or cone of silence?
Brian,
Teachers DO know what they got into with this profession. The whole idea of the public sector is that it is supposed to prevent the possibility of wealth while protecting from the dangers of recession.
Private sector folks love to talk about what they have lost in the recession. Where were you in the mid-90’s? When the economy was roaring and the private sector was raking in money hand over fist, where were these people clamoring for the public sector to share in the economic condition? When the economy is robust, the private sector screams “you know what you signed up for” as its mantra and excuse for not giving teachers huge raises (akin to the ones they enjoy). When the economy is BAD, however, all of the sudden it’s so important to share in the sacrifice?
Make up your mind. Either the teachers share in the sacrifice AND the good economic times, or they share in neither–receiving a steady paycheck that prevents them from both prosperity AND economic disaster. You know–what they signed up for in the first place.
I could have sworn the “whole idea of the public sector” was to collect taxes and use them to provide the minimum essential goods and services that wouldn’t otherwise be adequately dispensed by the marketplace and are critical to the health and growth of the nation. At least that’s what I read in the Federalist Papers. Your “whole idea” seems to imply something else; some entity that exists independently from its constituency.
Government exists to serve the taxpayers and citizens, and is not supposed to be an entitled special interest class.
We are on the path of fixing this wrongheaded ideology in Wisconsin.
Turning this back into a gripe session again I see. Sad….
Your complaints are so insignificant its laughable, and you wonder why so many are fed up with the teachers and their unions. I hope you are not a representation of the whole because it is rather scary.
You asked how come I feel the politicians and BOE should relinquish their pay and perks….You assume I do not? I am not irrational, of course I feel they should not get pay increases, and I agree with you that it is sickening that they do while freezing yours. But I still feel strongly that your “struggle” is over embellished to put it mildly. Both of my neighbors are public school teachers and neither of them are hurting for free time. Good luck in fooling others it will not work on me.
In society these days there is this stigma with admitting that you have it easy or that you have a good thing. The underdog mentality has been engrained into us. There is absolutley nothing wrong with knowing or admittig that you have a good thing going. Realizing that you might have it easier than the next guy, and appreciating that, does not make you less of a person. My last unit was EASY, I still stood my bi weekly 24 hour watch outside my normal work. I still was away from family 1-2 weeks a month for the first three years of it. And whenever any of my guys complained, I told them to count their blessings, you are not getting shot at I always said. You are not sleeping in the mud. It worked, they shut up and realized that life is not that bad. Stop whining and start counting your blessings, it makes life more fun!!
Have a great day!
Louis,
Thank you for your military service and protecting our country. I understand, but remember that you volunteered to serve your country. I did the same and went to war to defend this country. I am very thankful that I am no longer being shot at or sucking sand.
I am quite certain however if the government tomorrow told you that they would no longer honor the pay grade system and that soldiers now would be promoted but get NO MORE PAY for the new rank. Your soldiers would not be happy. Imagine a new private E-1 making the same as an E-4 or E-5…that is what has happened here with teachers. You can bet your sweet @## that you would have an issue in your unit.
Worktorule,
You actually have teachers getting promoted to higher positions of authority and not getting the commensurate pay for that position? Can you provide an example of such a promotion?
this country, the government and the citizens regulary make promises to her soldiers that we fail to keep, then fail to even appreciate the sacrifices and their families make to provide us with and preserve the most basic freedoms…if you really think being a teacher is a valid comparison with a soldier during a time of war out side an inner city school, maybe teaching is the wrong career path for you.
I understand what you are saying all to well, and trust me, there is no comparison in duty between a teacher and a soldier. Myself, my brother, and father have all been to war and we have sacrificed tremendously for this country. And I am quite familiar with the failed promises of our gov. to soldiers, but one thing they have never done…not honor the pay they promise to their soldiers.
For the most part you are right about that. But, they have actually not paid the soldiers before, back in the 90’s under Clinton. It was brief but it happened. This past 18 months we had a few scares and were actually told by senior leadership to prepare to be without pay for a couple of months on a few separate occasions. You know the whole continuing resolution because the CIC and his friends wont pass a budget. But its not that same as what you guys are facing, i’ll give you that. One thing the military and veterans have going for them is that politically its the last group anyone wants to cross.
Sorry, but soldiers did get paid during that gov. shut down. When the government shutdown in 1995, the United States was at peace. However, President Clinton rightly made sure that the government still paid its military.
The Bonus Army!!!!
Teacher steps can be fairly compared to the pay grade in the military. Not the best analogy, but it makes the point.
Do you think a first year teacher should be paid the same as a 4th year teacher? There is a set of skills, knowledge, and yes, responsibility that a 4th year teacher has earned that exceeds the usual 1st year teacher, just as the skills, knowledge, and responsibility of an E-4 exceeds that of a E-1 private.
There are many teachers who have taken on SOOO MUCH more in responsibility and get nothing for it. Here are a few
1. The running of afterschool programs and all the responsibility that go along with it= NO MORE PAY.
2. Teachers are used as “acting” AP’s in the office all the time, sometimes for nearly a full year with no additional pay. (This happens alot)
3. Teachers assigned/promoted to run a “team” or “academy” with no additional pay, but with serious amounts of additional responsibility, time, and planning required.
Worktorule,
I spent several years in the Military and during that time had many “additional duties” assigned from time to time in each of the pay grades that I served in during my career. At no time did I receive any additional pay for my assigned additional duties.
Your analogy of the military pay grades would be better described using the longevity pay steps that are included in the military pay system. These longevity pay increases are based only on time in service and have nothing to do with “merit” as I suspect your pay plan does. When steps are based on merit they are subject to funds being available.
I do understand how you feel, and I concur that several years with no cost of living increase or merit step increase is hard to swallow. But you are not alone. This also affects all employees of the county. If you stick together, work to rule, and only to rule, you will get some concession from the county, probably in the form of a step increase. Stay the course!
I never go alon to get along, you do not know me do not assume. And yes many people work hard on the fed level, but many do not. Those that work hard often carry the rest. Take care.
Louis Braddy you nailed it. – “Those that work hard often carry the rest.”
This is what I call my one of three rule in government work.
One works to carry two others.
Phil if you believe the country is not weakened you are an idiot, Simple as that.
So the county has a surplus, what makes teachers think the deserve it? As taxpayers we voted for the people we thought would spend our money wisely. A surplus is exactly what we wanted to see. Now that said, after weighing the options and deciding where best to spend the money they dternine teachers need a raise, roger up and do it.
However, as a tax payer this is what I see. The public schools being outperformed by the private schools. Our return on investment is not very good for public schools. So why continue to invest. This is most likely not the fault of the teachers but a disfuntional system. Either way, I say give the surplus back to the taxpayers to do what we see fit with. We are the majority.
This is why I support school vouchers. We should not have to pay into a system that does not produce. Again, I dont really blame teachers for the poor output of public schools, in their deffense the system is severly disfunctional. However, We should have the choice to send our kids where we see fit, and not be penalized when sending our kids to private school.
Are there any teachers in here that would support a voucher system?
“…does not produce”…you do know that Maryland has the #1 schools in the country, right? And our county is one of the best? Bring on the vouchers.
#1 schools based on flawed testing. All my kids seem to do anymore is get tested. While this is not a fault of teachers, it is indicative a broken system that can’t possibly be sustained much longer. Something has to give.
I agree. Lets shut all the schools down and just forget about education. It will save Joe the taxpayer a lot of money. Then we can put these teachers to work in a real occupation like prison guards, which surely we will need more of. Oh wait. They are public employees too. That would require tax money. Ok back the truck up. Let’s shut all the schools down and all the jails. I don’t think we should have cops either. You know what? No taxes. Hey this is really coming together. This neo-conservative “government is evil, no taxes, don’t tread on me” stuff really makes a lot of sense.
Just to let you know, I found out that you have the right to opt your kids out of testing. I am!!!
What does that accomplish (other than your kid doesn’t have to get stressed over a standardized if he’s the type to do so?) The teacher still has to teach to the test for the rest of class so there’s no difference in what’s being taught.
How? I was unaware of this. Perhaps others may wish to become aware…..and MD’s ranking is not based on testing alone but a flury of other categories too.
Louis, I will ask you this: Should the public schools, therefore, be allowed not to admit students they do not want in their school? Should the public schools be allowed to omit students to keep teacher/student ratios comparable to private schools? Should public schools decide that some students are too disruptive and not permit them to attend? Or should private schools be compelled to admit AND keep ALL students who apply and attend, thus increasing that ratio?
Comparing public and private schools is dishonest. If I could pick my students and keep my class sizes well below the 30+ kids I see daily… and have the vested interest of parents comparable to private school parents… yeah, you would get more positive results. Of course we wouldn’t be operating like a public school either.
And lastly… none of this has anything to do with the fact that county negotiated in bad faith on the contract. They said theu couldn’t fund a negotiated agreement and they could.
I’d think more people would be upset that their elected officials are behaving so dishonestly. Perhaps that is the new norm…
“Should public schools decide that some students are too disruptive and not permit them to attend?”
YES!!! As long as it is a valid, unbiased, indiscriminate, system that does it and accurate, comprehensive assessments of disruptive students are made by qualified counselors with the appropriate qualifications in the appropriate accredited behavioral sciences suited to the tasks those students should not be permitted to attend the desired standard school environment. Those qualifications should be part of the qualifications of counselors, should be tasked and part of their performance now. I’m sure many people already thought they were.
There could or should be steps along with as should already be mandated responsibilities of parents to abate the disruption prior to students removal.
Isn’t that partially what the PTA is for? Those things were dealt with by my wife and myself. They were told they were not allowed to disrupt class for others and especially, not be belligerent to teachers first and foremost. My children both graduated and went on to college have graduated or are in the process of graduating. And,…I might add most all of their friends did to if, they were to socialize with my kids.
The teacher should have clear and set guidelines for reporting to the counselors. At some point the situation should be handed off to the administrators.
At all times that teacher should be to maintain a continuity of the learning progress, accelerate, advance or enhance the level of academia for that class.
For that disruptive student there should be mandated responsibilities for that parent just as there are mandatory legal child support payments and legal violations regarding truancy. There is where your money is being wasted. Make those parents do community service(assist crossing guards, maintenance, groundskeeping, etc…) One can easily come up with graduated levels of punitive obligations for both.
That is better than having that one or few disrupt the process for a class of thirty that could otherwise accelerate in the learning process.
Unless, we are speaking of inappopriate student/teacher relationships most of the societal problems teachers face from students are not caused by the teachers themselves.
Someone on ths post said that in may cases students are coming out of high school poorly prepared and have to take remedial courses. That is documented fact. But the interesting part of that statement was the retort from Benkins. Rather than disagree he said “that is a systemic issue”. Of course he couldn’t disagree because the frequency of college students taking remedial courses has skyrocketed. But now we have educators saying, in effect, “Yes, students are less well prepared than in the past but that’s not my fault, man, it’s a systemic issue!” What the h%^& does that mean? The good stuff is courtesy of the teachers but the failures are not their fault? See that is the kind of crap that makes people paint educators with that broad brush that labels them arrogant jerks. A systemic problem indeed! Teachers, you are the system. In your classroom is where the rubber meets the road. If students can’t add or subtract or balance their checkbook or calculate interest then it’s all on you, baby! That’s why parents put them in your care. To teach them to deal successfully with life. If you can’t or won’t do it then maybe that explains why home schooling is thru the roof and is actually working even better than I thought it ever would.
Alex, is it still the teacher’s fault when the TEACHER assigns a failing grade and MOM and DAD cry to the principal to CHANGE it over the OBJECTION of the TEACHER and DOES? At times in my career my administrator has stood behind me and not changed the grade… only to have someone much higher on the food chain do so. So, when the administrator gets tired of getting over-ruled and does the inevitable… tell HOW IS THIS MY FAULT? How am I to be blamed that parents want high grades to get into good schools, when they have been intimidating the schools into pushing their kid through unprepared? Tell me… I really want you thoughts on this.
HOW would YOU grade a STUDENT who uses CAPITALIZATION IMPROPERLY to get their point across, as if they were SHOUTING at YOU?
I add the all caps to provide emphasis, if you could tell me how to use the italics function, if it exists, I’d appreciate it. If you find this highly offensive I apologize, it was not my intent. It would have been wiser of me to explain my use of all caps, I now understand there are a few people here that are so easily offended. Again, my apologies.
Oh, I am not offended, I just find it amusing that a teacher would resort to the equivalent of shouting to get their point across.
@REALLY?
I find it sad that teachers now haev to resort to shouting and protests to get a point across.
@Really? Fair enough, you are not offended but amused. I suppose attempting to add emphasis in an environment that such capabilities was unwise of me. It wasn’t shouting, I do understand that all caps suggest that in this type of forum. I thought explaining how and why I used it here was sufficient – I guess not.
This has happened to me as well. Alex, I recommend that you go to the top for answers. We are still running our education systems under the assumption that certain values are in place…respect for education, embarrassment of failure, fear of punishment. These are not in place so much any more in many places. Research shows retention doesn’t work, but we have nothing else in place at the moment. Ask the district leaders what there thoughts are on this. Trust and believe that teachers want to hold students accountable, but are unable to do so.
Well, if you changed the grade then you assumed accountability for the problem. If you refused to change the grade then the accountability remained with whoever did change it. If it didn’t get changed – and I’m assuming it should not have been changed – then tell the parents to pound sand. Of course in a much more diplomatic way. And I would expect your supervisor/administrator to be right there with you. If the aren’t backing you up when you are right and need their support then they need to go. The dumbing down of America starts or ends in your classroom. It continues or stops with your supervisor. Simplistic? Right and wrong is always a more simplistic choice than we think it is. Do the right thing!
Rest assured I don’t change grades. My hands are clean.
I am curious of something, though, I asked you about a scenario where parents were demanding a grade changed to something higher than earned. You spread accountability throughout the ranks of school staff, but not to the parents. Why is that?
“The dumbing down of America starts or ends in your classroom.” At some point you have to hold parents accountable – when would that be? Do you expect me to go home with my students each night to check their homework?
“Do the right thing.” I agree. The BOE negotiated a contract to restore 2 steps and a COLA. The County Executive and County Council claimed they did not have sufficient funds to do so, but they in fact did. Actually the courts so far have agreed. So yes! I’m with you Alex, do the right thing and tell the county officials to stop the lying and honor the agreement made! Do the right thing!
Read this comment and the replies and how can you NOT think that all of you are just nuts and need a new hobby!!
Alex R
How are we suppose to combat the brain that has played videos for 12 hours straight? How are we suppose to combat the brain that is full of inappropriate reality TV shows, rap music and/or hardrock. How are we suppose to combat the parent that NEVER makes a kid open a book, do homework or anything that promotes learning? What do you do with a kid who has been so neglected that you can only deal with the emotional pieces and not the cognitive pieces. There are so many other factors out of our control. If I put a kid on a diet and provided healthy food but the parent allows candy, sugar and processed food all day, the kid will never lose weight. Same concept!!!!!
Alex,
You are right…the rubber meets the road in the classroom. But it also meets the road at home. You show me a student who has a parent that doesn’t care about their education, doesn’t work with them at home to reinforce what they learn at school, or just expects the teacher to be their babysitter…and I’ll show you a student who will fail miserably no matter how good a teacher they have. Education is a three pronged process…teachers, students and parents. If ANY one of those three break down, the whole process is broken. On the other hand…you show me a student who may only be average or below academically…but has a parent who cares about education, works with them at home, is in contact with the teachers about their childs education and reinforces the value of education at home with their kid…and I’ll show you a sucessful student.
Your responsibility is to do the right thing. If you don’t then you have become accountable for what happens when you don’t. Sorry, but that is the way it works.
Why do parents demand stupid stuff? Because when they demanded it in the past the got it. You can’t fix all of the wrongs in the administration and the student’s home but you can say that you won’t go along to get along. When you do, you become part of the problem and not part of the solution.
Alex,
While I apprecite what you’re saying, it just doesn’t work that way in HCPS. You mentioned in a previous post about changing a grade that the teacher needs to stick to their guns and do what’s right. And that if the administrator isn’t with them, then the admin has to go. The problem is…some admins (not all but a lot) DON’T support their teachers and fold to parents like cheap lawn chairs. And to say the admin has to go…good luck with that. Everyone says it’s so hard to get rid of an incompetant teacher…try getting rid of an incompetant admin…you’d have a better chance of getting hit by lightening every day this week. It simply doesn’t work that way in HCPS. If the admin wants something done…it’s going to be done…wrong or right. Idealistically, the teacher would say no, I’m not changing the grade and if you would like, you can talk to my principal. And then the principal would listen to the parent and say, I’m sorry, my teacher has been with your student all year and they know the work they’ve done…I support their decision 100%. That’s on paper…in reality, what happens is the complete opposite a lot of times. And nothing can be done because the supervisor of the principals (elementary or secondary supervisor for the county) won’t do anyting to an admin. And Baltimore County Bob surely isn’t going to step in and do something…nobody even knows what he looks like because he hides on Hickory Ave. I’ve personally known admins who have done and got away with the following when I was a HCPS teacher: Sleeping with the PTA president during the school day (parents would ask why his car was parked in her driveway during the school day…Jackie Haas knew about this and did nothing)…Sleeping with multiple teachers in the same building…and when each found out about the other, a near war started that day in school…An admin shoving a student into a wall in his office for talking bac to him…an admin being told a student had a toy gun, giving the gun to him and the admin doing nothing about it (his exact quote was “I’m not going to make headlines in the Aegis”) when HCPS policy on guns of any sort, toy or not, are an automatic 10 day suspension and referral to the board…a student swinging baseball bat at a gym teacher and the admin (same guy that didn’t want to make headlines in the Aegis) givng the kid one hour of afterschool detention…and the list goes on and on.
I hear you. It’s your choice. You either go along to get along or you do what is right. Sounds like some of you guys sure are a randy bunch.
One interesting aspect of “not being prepared for college” is the financial aspect. My neice was in all the top math classes at her school. She took the math placement test at HCC and was shocked to fail. The test asked questions she had never learned. So now, here she is in a remedial math class relearning everything she did learn in her high school math classes to the point that the instructor told her she didn’t belong in there. Talk to the high school math teachers…HCC (and many other colleges) test incoming freshman on things they know are not part of the curriculum to increase the failure rate. Why? Because now that student is forced to pay for a class that they will receive no credit in (because it’s remedial) but cannot go on to credit classes until they complete it. It pads the coffers of the colleges and allows them to blame the high schools for not preparing them. It’s the same reason why so many colleges are no longer accepting AP credit-why give a student credit for a ‘free’ class they took in high school when you can charge them a couple hundred dollars a class instead? Yet Maryland wants more students in AP classes and taking exams that aren’t going to give them any credit at college.
Cha-ching!! It’s also a money making scheme…not just an educational reform issue.
I think this is more of a case of teaching to the test rather than actually learning the material. If the student had actually learned the material in the “top” math classes, there is no way they could fail. Math is more than reciting facts and some people just have problems with tests.
Except that her remedial math class is almost a duplicate of her high school algebra classes and she currently has a 105% with extra credit questions. So HCC isn’t even teaching to their own placement test since they aren’t teaching her what she didn’t know on their test…they’re re-teaching high school algebra. That’s about money, not learning.
More educational corruption!
A dead fish stinks from the head to the tail.
You absolutely correct about AP being all about the money for the testing company and inflated bragging rights for individual schools and school systems.
Can you be certain this isn’t simply a case of the college satisfying it’s own immediate needs for providing a paid for class for someone that really doesn’t need it? Personally I would not put it past them. I have seen them be mercenary in other regards. Other people are not always interested in what is in your best interest. Ascribing a more noble motive because they are a college ignores the fact they employ the same caliber of people you and I run into on a daily basis.
@ Worktorule. I am well aware i volunteered to serve so that is why you do not hear me complaining. But teachers volunteer and they also serve but They seem to loose sight of the serve part and suplimebt that with entitlement.
I will say this, If there are promotions in the HCPU system and they are not getting compensated for the additional repsponsibilty that is in fact wrong. But dont be mistaken, it does happen in the military as well. Its officially called frocking. But unofficially, miltary memebers are constantly leaned on to take additional responsibilties, that is a fact! We dont get officially promoted because our budget has been slashed by 30% under our current CIC. Instead we are just asked to do more and more and go years without promotions in a stagnant invironment. But hey, we dont have the option to protest because it is voluntary service.
Those that dont like it just get out. I guess the same can be said for teachers. I guess what I am saying is we all need to acknolwedge that the public education system is broken from the top down. Funneling more money into will not fix it. I realize teachers are people but so are our taxpayers footing the bill.
I think a voucher system will breed many self corecting behaviors in the school system. And who knows, maybe techers would even be happier in a voucher environment!! I suspect, inorder to keep up with competition, private schools might start having better compensation packages. In turn opening up more options for teachers. I see it as a win win.
First of all you talk like teachers don’t pay taxes and get pay over the summer when they are off , well they don’t. And the school system is not the military and teacher are not soldier.
Louis,
We are not in the military and do not have vouchers so stop comparing teachers and education to it. You enlisted with no degree and we went to approximately 7 years of school and we just want what our contrat state.
I meant contract
Hmmm. Someone tell me where i can read the contract that the county defaulted on? I would like to see it.
I hear your point about school size and disallowing disruptive students. That is why i say we cant blame the teachers but we should blame a broken system. Vouchers should simply be money aloud to private schools with out goverment regulatuon. This means my property tax goes to whomever I want. Where would i put it? Private schools where they eliminate disruptive kids and underperforming teachers.
Now the reality, especially in the state of MD, would see vouchers being used as an excuse for government overreach into the private schools in an attempt to regulate them. Thus screwing it up over again.
Louis,
Go here to see the contract. Page 50 in the contract (page 57 in the document) has the payscale for teachers. The left side where it says “Experience” shows that a teacher with “X” number of years of “experience WILL get the following pay….but our county has not upheld this contract at all and a 3rd or 4th year teacher with much more EXPERIENCE/STEP makes the same as a year one.
The Dagger won’t let the link post….so just do a google search for
hcps negotiated agreement
and click on the first link for the contract.
Louis better read the whole contract because if and when he does he will se that there is more to it than that.
Louis,
Vouchers don’t make any sense because frankly, the amount of your property tax that goes to education isn’t enough to pay for a low-quality private school. People see that the county pays X number of dollars per student, but the money isn’t actually divvied up equally like that. Federal law demands that special education kids get certain services. Those services are fairly expensive (which is why most private schools don’t accept special education kids).
Further, the amount of money to be sent back would immediately be smaller than what we have now. EVERYONE pays property tax to fund the public school system. Many of those people don’t have kids or no longer have school-aged kids. The reason why the government can justify taxing the childless to pay for your child’s education is because of the documented (and significant) correlation between school quality and property value. If you send out vouchers so that you can send you child to an outside school, that correlation (and the justification for using property tax money from the childless on education) suddenly doesn’t make any sense.
I like the idea of vouchers, but the only way to make it work is to:
A: Find a new means of funding education (since the property tax format would no longer apply)
and
B: Find a way to pay for vouchers (with that drastically reduced pile of money) while still following federal laws regarding services for special education students.
Vouchers are frequently brought up on this website. I frequently point out these realities and ask for ideas on how to address the problem. Nobody has yet taken me up on that challenge/come up with a solution.
Teaching is a professional job. It requires a four year degree and a masters. When they are hiring teachers they are promised alot more than they receive. If teaching was in the private sector they would make more than the salary they do currently. Sure they the option of not teaching but thank goodness the good teachers have decided to stay in this field. We expect teachers to raise and discipline our children. If a child does not live up to our standards we blame teachers not parents. If teachers were not so important, why not hire anyone off the street? Why does the county have have job specifications? The teachers needs something from the government to let them know that they are appreciated.
I don’t expect teachers to raise my child. I can handle that on my own. That mindset is exactly why public schools are failing. Teachers can not do it all.
There are many people with Master’s degrees that are either laid off/seeking employment, or that have taken pay cuts in recent years. I think most non-teachers on here hear what you all are saying, but we need you all to understand that we are indeed feeling the same pains.
My wife and I do not expect our children’s teachers to raise them, that is quite the opposite of what we feel. My 3rd grader has straight A’s right now because she works hard, she is rewarded at home and supported at home, and because has an outstanding teacher. The same teacher who has been leaving this week when students do, and good for her and good for you all. You have the right to protest not getting pay raises, just remember that the rest of us can support what you do, yet tell you not to count on raises. This is what many of us hear year in and year out at our own jobs.
When I drive through Cedar Day or Glenangus, or parts of North Harford I find that hard to believe….
Robin,
I know it wasn’t a lot but your union did jam up you getting the bonus. You got half of it eventually but if the HCEA had some real leadership you would have got it all in December.
This is true…but remember that we do not have a union. If we did everything would be different. We have an association, it is not, and cannot function like a union.
Nice try but if you really look at the people on Dagger who claim to be teachers the overwhelming majority of them call it a union. If is the only group that is allowed to collectively bargain for teachers. It signs labor agreements on behalf of teachers. It agrees to salary and benefits on behalf of teachers pending membership ratification of the membership. What can’t it do? Call a strike. But then there a number of unions that can’t do that. Call it what you want but it is what it is. BTW, since you are off this summer you may want to go to one of the local universities and take a labor law course and you will get a little more knowledge on unions/associations and collective bargaining and labor contracts.
And, no, if you had a ‘union’ it wouldn’t be different at all.
Alex,
Usually your comments are rational and educated. You identified the huge difference between OUR association, that I don’t belong to, and a union. The ability to call a strike. It is the lack of this powerful tool that makes them totally different from eachother. Thanks for the offer to be a labor expert, but I have many more important things to do this summer…lol.
What could you possibly have to do this summer that is more important than really, really understanding your union/association and the labor contract that decides what you get paid and what benefits you get and what rights you have and don’t have? I don’t mean listen to what the BOE says the contract means and don’t listen to what the HCEA says the contract means, and absolutely don’t listen to what others say the contract means. Be an educated employee. You put a lot of time and money into being a teacher now put just a little in to understanding the document that decides the finances of you and your family. There so much mis-information on here that it makes me want to throw up. Teachers with advanced degrees who think that the collective bargaining agreement means that they have to get step increases no matter what. It doesn’t say that and it has never said that. Read it. Every word from beginning to end.
If teachers really want to band together and show how much they care they should “strike” this summer. I know that by definition it won’t be a strike since you aren’t witholding labor, but get your signs out there this summer and use your voice. I know that some teachers work in the summer, but not every day all summer long, so take those days you don’t work and picket in Bel Air. The reality is that people will not want to spend their time off this summer picketing in Bel Air, but if it means that much to you you’ve got to put up or shut up. I would venture to guess there would be hundreds each day who could picket in front of the board office and in front of county government buildings. It’s unfortunate that we are in this volatile situation, and there doesn’t seem to be an end in sight but the back and forth on this site seems to only stir up more anger on both sides.
Man, what a beautiful day. So nice to be done work this early for once and enjoy the day. TGIF
When the school system was ordered to go back to the table and re-negotiate. the union should realize that yes, the teachers got hosed with the lack of steps, but in the ongoing financial problems, so were almost everyone else. That being said, keep a reasonable thought process on upcoming steps, but remove any nad all language on additional assignments or work. The schools want hall monitors and cafeteria monitors, that’s an additional duty that comes at a price. school events, clubs,sports.. all addtional paid duties. And make the pay an amount resonable to the time put in. Make everything outside of teh school hours and teaching an itemized cost. Same as if you add additinal packages to a new car or take a suit to the cleaners.
It’s not a “raise”, people! Teachers are NOT asking for a raise! Teachers are only picketing because they want want their contract says they are going to earn each year. Stop calling it a “raise”…..there is a big difference between demanding a raise and fulfilling a contract…geez. Since I’m at home now, I can step out of my professional role and say that I am tired of all the morons on here that think teachers want to raise your taxes so we can get rich. Goodness.
I will remind you of the obvious. Any additional money from year A to your B is a raise. We in the private sector don’t make these ridiculour distinctions.
As American Citizens, teachers have the right to voice their opinions. Teachers have the right to peacefully assemble and try to educate the community about what is going on with the County Council and the BOE. Sadly, teachers are met with disrespectful remarks and are told to “stop their whining”. No wonder morale is so low… teachers get very little respect. As many people have stated, teachers did not get into education for the money. And whether you believe that teachers are adequately compensated for their jobs or not, they deserve to be respected just as much as other American Citizens.
I’m not sure when teachers became villains, but it’s so sad to see some of these vitriolic and spiteful posts.
I am a graduate of HCPS and returned from PA 3 years ago to teach and give back to the county (and state) that I love. I transferred into HCPS with a few years of teaching experience and haven’t received the steps that were outlined in my contract. But at the end of the day, I feel that teaching is my calling and not just my job.
Quick change of pace for the Dagger…positivity, anyone?
I wanted to post here to say that I am SO grateful for the encouraging emails that I have received this week from parents thanking me for working with their children during this school year. As the year wraps up, notes from the students, thank you cards from parents, emails, calls and words of kindness really do abound in many of our schools. I am grateful for it. It keeps me going as the negativity and disrespect from the County Council, BOE, and Dagger posters discourage me. I’d like to think the extremists on this blog are the minority…they’re just…LOUDER and more public than the moderate folks. As my own morale and hopeful spirit have dwindled this year, it has been so very encouraging when parents and students thank me for a job well done. It has helped me to hold on and believe that things will get better in HCPS. Please keep the encouragement coming; your child’s teacher will appreciate it more than you know. It doesn’t cost anything and it doesn’t even have to be public. The teachers who are still hopeful and positive need to see that they are working in and for a county that values education and recognizes the hard work of its educators.
Did you (or your children) ever have a really great teacher in HCPS?
Could we talk about that for a second?
We’re really not villains.
I am with you.
Well said!
Here here!
Ms Vajda was my son’s math teacher in Bel Air Middle School. Initially I was upset that she assigned so much homework for him… up to an hour a night. Then, when he went on to other math classes I had a chance to meet her again and was able to tell her personally how much I appreciated her style of teaching. I apologized for my original criticism of her approach and thanked her profusely for her teaching.
Porter, so you admit you don’t know everything.
So true sometimes the best end of the year gift is a little thank you letter.
I will second that!
Instead of teacher vs. non-teacher, I feel everyone’s vitriol here on The Dagger would be better directed at the BOE and/or Tombeck. They decide where the money is spent. As a taxpayer, I feel that the teachers contract should be honored. I will never believe there is not fat elsewhere in the budget where savings could occur. If you don’t get enough money from the county council, non-contract positions/raises should be the ones be cut. I don’t see the BOE not honoring Tombeck’s contract. Cutting the essentials, ie teachers, building maintenence is always the best way to scare the taxpayer into increasing the budget through the county council.
Katelyn,
Here is what the BOE and Tomback will tell you. They will say that they cannot fund teacher salary increases unless and until the County provides the money for them to do so. And to some extent they are correct. What they won’t talk about is the tremendous waste that is being funded in the HCPS system. You now and I know and even Ryan Burbey knows that the waste is staggering. A lot, but not all, of the waste is in non-classroom personnel. When these unnecessary positions are eliminated you save the salaries and the benefits and the ancillary budgets associated with those positions. Often those positions result in more distraction and frustration to classroom personnel and get in the way of teachers teaching what needs to be taught and doing it effectively. What I don’t know is whether they are able to cut the waste and, if the can, would it be enough to fund step increases. It might require an entire change in HCPS leadership. A new leader should come in with this question first and foremost – “Are you a non-classroom employee? If you are then unless we can fully justify the existence of your position your job is in jeopardy.”
My mother would have tanned my hide if I disrespected teachers like some of these people. She would probably still try it even at 90. You can make a conservative point or two without being a classless and rude excuse for a human being.
Anyone who wants to ridicule teachers who are asking for their contracts to be honored, after 3 years, needs to spend a week in a classroom and have their eyes opened. The thank-yous are few and far between and most people (parents, admin, students) are looking to blame YOU for what YOU didn’t do when in reality you’ve done X, Y, and Z to cover your butt and it still doesn’t matter. When we can get back to worrying about teaching an engaging lesson and having students actively participate without the rude, disrespectful behavior, then I think maybe we’d all be happier with or without the money.
What can a parent do to support the teachers in this?
Parents can write letters to Dr. Tomback and each member of the Board of Education – same letter can go to each person. Parents can attend Monday night’s Board of Ed meeting in Bel Air at 7pm and voice their support!
STAND UP FOR PUBLIC EDUCATION!!!
Come to the Board of Education meeting on Monday.
MEETING OF THE BOARD OF EDUCATION
MONDAY, JUNE 11, 2012
HCPS A. A. ROBERTY BUILDING
102 S. Hickory Avenue, Bel Air, MD 21014
Board Business Meeting – 7:00 P.M. – Board Room
Come to the Board of Education meeting on Monday.
MEETING OF THE BOARD OF EDUCATION
MONDAY, JULY 11, 2011
HCPS A. A. ROBERTY BUILDING
102 S. Hickory Avenue, Bel Air, MD 21014
Board Open Session – 6:25 P.M. – Board Room
Board Closed Session – 6:30 P.M. – Board Executive Conference Room
Board Business Meeting – 7:00 P.M. – Board Room
Please come to the Board of Education meeting *THIS Monday*, June 11, 2012! Teachers will be meeting at Bel Air High School and will march to the meeting together.
Don’t forget to get a parade permit or your union dues might go up even higher to pay the fines. Maybe they will break $600 next year?
“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”
Anyone can petition for redress of grievences peacefully and in a non-disruptive fashion, but the Supreme Court has held that municipalities can require permits to regulate scheduling, reimbursement for police/clean up costs, signal/traffic control, amplified voices, minimize disruptions for those not involved, etc for groups and organized protests. That is why you see the OWS crowd repeating the speakers, because NYC wpuld not give them a permit for a bullhorn.
Cut and paste error. June 11th. I got it off the BoE website. July 11 isn’t a Monday.
@Peter….Well said!
Support your Schools!
STAND UP FOR PUBLIC EDUCATION!!!
Come to the Board of Education meeting on Monday.
MEETING OF THE BOARD OF EDUCATION
MONDAY, JUNE 11, 2011
HCPS A. A. ROBERTY BUILDING
102 S. Hickory Avenue, Bel Air, MD 21014
Board Open Session – 6:25 P.M. – Board Room
Board Closed Session – 6:30 P.M. – Board Executive Conference Room
Board Business Meeting – 7:00 P.M. – Board Room
It’s 2012.
Yep sure is. I messed up. The BoE lists the most recent meetings last.
Burbey, you messed up? Tell me something new.
I think the reason Tomback doesn’t come out in support of the teachers is because directing the community’s angst against the teachers makes him free to continue squandering the money the public invests in the schools. Seriously, why in the world during this economic crisis did he think it was beneficial to take an entourage to China?? What in the world was there to learn from a school system that exists to educate only the elite? How much tax money was wasted funding that trip and the substitutes paid to cover the admins on vacation? The newly created supervisor of middle school? What a waste of money!! All middle schools have principals supervising. There are curriculum supervisors for all subjects taught. What in the heck is a supervisor of middle school doing??? Supervising the supervisors?
NOBODY holds the Harford County administrators responsible for the misuse of school funds. What we expect the Board of Education to do is NOT being done.
The teachers are the backbone of a successful educational system. Good teachers will choose the neigboring districts that support the contract and pay better. They will stop coming to Harford County. After all, you get what you pay for.
Harford County teachers work hard and are dedicated to their students. It would be a dream to see Tomback and the Board dedicate themselves to the heart of the school system – the teachers
Amen! This really got to the root of the problem…waste at the top.
I work in a middle school that has not made AYP and I haven’t seen the Director of Middle Schools once in my building since the position was created. What does that tell you?
HCPS pays the people who have the least affect on students the most. Research shows that the teacher directly in front of the students has the biggest impact on achievement. The payscale should reflect this research. If we invested the $ into attracting and keeping the best teachers, we wouldn’t need the fluff at the top anyway.
David Porter,
I will not use my real name because when I did 2 years ago, I received anonymous phone calls which scared my family. I won’t put them through that again. If I told you where I worked, you wouldn’t believe me, and that has nothing to do with my posts. Further, I am not little, or any of the other comments you made. You identified that you worked for the ATC, and I am familiar with it, and I commented on the reason that the name was changed to ATC. If you can’t take it, you shouldn’t give it. I find you overbearing in your remarks and will not hesitate to point it out at every opportunity. If you don’t like it, get over it.
You’re funny. You make personal attacks based on information that is given you and when you are challenged to be upfront you hide and say “I am harassed for my views” Welcome to the world of adults, where some are more adult than others. You are simply belittling because it feeds your ego to do so. That makes you arrogant. And probably asocial. Carry on Monster. Go back into the closet or back under the bed.
Porter, what difference does it make what my real name is or where I work. If your comment is a meant as a threat to me, I would happy to meet you anywhere anytime. Then you can find out if I am all that you say. You can give it out, you just can’t take it. That is a sign of insecurity and immaturity. I would be happy in person to tell you where you can go.
I’ve heard the comment about immaturity and insecurity before. My name is here. I have been very forward and honest about who I am. You hide behind a pseudonym and take pot shots in a forum against people you have a difficult time tolerating. I once told a young lady that hiding is the domain of cowards and criminals. Since that time, she has been tagged for a variety of driving violations (three license suspensions), defrauding the state of Maryland for unemployment benefits and defamation of character. Her total judgments in the last two years now amount to nearly $30,000. I’m sorry you feel you have to hide your identity because of fear of reprisal. But if you truly do not wish the attention, perhaps you should consider achieving an even lower level of visibility.
(This comment was previously posted in another thread, but seems appropriate here as well):
Here is what I’ve learned from reading many of the comments here:
1) No one deserves a raise as long as somebody, somewhere, is unemployed.
2) As long as you have a job, you should be “thankful” which means a)you surrender your right to speak out on behalf of yourself and your profession, and b)you accept being bullied, harassed, and taken advantage of by your employer in exchange for a paycheck.
3) The management’s refusal to uphold a contract with employees is acceptable provided that it saves the consumers money.
4) Meeting but not exceeding the terms of a labor contract by the employees is the sign of a character flaw, and is indicactive of a poor employee.
5) The ineptitude of an individual professional is representative of the profession in its entirety.
6) If you find yourself unhappy with your work situation, your primary focus should be finding new employment, rather than attempting to adjust perceived inequities.
7) If you choose to work in a social services profession, you surrender your right to better your own life in exchange for bettering the lives of everyone else.
Logic, you chose a very apt name. I think your post is brilliant, succinct and on the mark.
Give Porter some lessons would you?
@Monster
I enjoy your posts, but please call David A. Porter by his full name so no one confuses him with me.
David A. Porter and my views are in opposition for the most part.
But not always.
Porter, my apologies for mixing you up with David A. Porter and I will make sure not to insult you like this again.
Wow, we are on a hate inspired spree. You poor pitiful man, or whatever you are.
http://www.publicschoolreview.com/articles/108
The above should answer most of your questions concerning if we are legit .
No, that article really didn’t answer any questions or prove anything. Please try again!
NOPE!!!! Didn’t prove anything to me either. I think he or she is a bunch of bull. If the report was so bad then they would have taken action.
Fraud. Post your real name. Or return to the obscurity you enjoyed before you attempted to imitate a real entity.
Are you still trying to use smoke and mirrors to sell your fake organization?
David A.Porter,
How am I hiding? I told you before- I will be happy to meet you any place, any time.
Monster. That would be unwise since you clearly like to hide from scrutiny in a public forum. Without knowing what you are except by your willingness to shout from obscurity, I doubt meeting you would resolve anything. If it makes you more comfortable to hide in your lurkem, please continue to do so. You scare the crap out of me with your anonymous personal attacks.
David A. (we know what the A. stands for) Porter,
You amaze me. You criticize people constantly, talk big and say little. When someone does this to you, you get highly offended. I challenge you with this behavior and you find it appalling. Perhaps, you should spend some time thinking about how you affect others with your remarks. Oh, after reading so many of your posts, you seem to be afraid of many things. Don’t worry I won’t hurt you physically because I imagine you are a little geek.
And you are intimidated. Stay in your hole… come out when you are full of venom. Just don’t ever let anyone know who you are or where you work because they will come for you in the dark of night with pitchforks and torches. Bad Monster.
David a Porter, you amaze me. Don’t you think people are tired of hearing from us? Yet, you always want the last word. Since I am immature according to you, I am not going to let you get it. By the way, I am thinking of counting up your emails on all of the sites and the time of day they were sent. Are you sending these on government time, or do you get this much time off? Inquiring minds want to know.
Good comment about david a porter. he makes me sick.