Regional economic, political, and military leaders gathered Wednesday to mark the end of what they called a highly successful first chapter of Harford County’s Base Realignment and Closure experience.
Noticeably absent from the final BRAC “Town Hall” meeting at Aberdeen High School were local residents, who numbered less than 20 and were outnumbered more than two-to-one by the assembly of staffers and executives from a variety of economic organizations, military personnel from Aberdeen Proving Ground, and local elected officials.
A series of speakers from all three groups highlighted the smooth integration into APG of military organizations transferred from Ft. Monmouth, N.J. and elsewhere, but touched only lightly on the elephant in the room: ongoing traffic concerns which have begun clogging Route 40 and Route 22 at rush hour.
The last in a series of public meetings on the BRAC process came six days before the Sept. 15 deadline set by the Army for the move of thousands of jobs and several major commands to APG. Despite lingering transportation issues, the six-year-long process has been among the smoothest the Army has ever seen, Major General Nick Justice, APG senior installation commander, said Wednesday.
By the Numbers
A portion of the presentation given by Harford County Economic Development Director Jim Richardson follows, outlining many of the key statistics the county claimed BRAC has brought. Among them:
–APG will grow from a $3.5 billion installation to one totaling $20 billion;
–67 percent of the 8,300 employees affected by BRAC relocated with their jobs;
–60 percent of those moving with BRAC chose to reside in Harford County, according to a study conducted by one of the relocating organizations;
–APG is tied with Johns Hopkins University as the state’s third largest employer by number of employees, with approximately 25,000—only the University of Maryland system and Ft. Meade are larger;
–the average household income in Harford County has grown to $84,000 from $73,000.
Town Hall Meeting – Release to Dagger
The boost to the area’s economy will help make Harford County one of the cornerstones of the “Maryland Research Triangle,” running from Ft. Detrick to Naval Air Station Patuxent River to APG, and encompassing Ft. Meade and Andrews Air Force base, said Tom Sadowski, chair of the county-created BRAC Planning Advisory Commission. As California’s technology corridor has long been known as “Silicon Valley” and a similar area around Austin, Texas became known as “Silicon Hills,” Sadowski said BRAC will make Maryland a new “Silicon Bay.”
That change will also reshape Aberdeen Proving Ground itself, as it loses much of what remained of its stationed, uniformed personnel and replaces them with a civilian employee and contractor workforce. Col. Orlando Ortiz, commander of the APG Garrison, said the total number of homes on post at the end of fiscal year 2013 will decline from about 1,006 to 372. Numbers showing the net change in several personnel categories from fiscal year 2003 to fiscal year 2015 are presented below:
Active Military: -258
Reserve Military and Transitional Personnel: +848
Military Trainees and Students: -2,981
Army Civilian Employees: +5,773
Embedded Contractors: +2,430
Other Civilian Contractors: +752
Total: +6,564
Most major military bases see a rotation of servicemen and women moving through but, Justice said, “just the opposite happened here, you have young soldiers moving out, and a more permanent base of professionals moving in.”
Traffic, Jammed
To make BRAC a reality, the Army secured funds totaling $1.3 billion for the construction of 2.8 million square feet of space on APG. Meanwhile, Craig said Harford County invested $300 million in “capital projects” related to BRAC, which he said included the construction of Deerfield Elementary School, Red Pump Elementary School, Bel Air High School, and Edgewood High School as well as the expansion of the Abingdon water treatment plant.
But the expansion and evolution of the county’s transportation infrastructure remains mostly on the drawing board, drawing criticism from at least one local politician. Work has begun on a widening of Route 715 near the APG gate, but has progressed little further than approximately 200 yards of an unstriped, unusable extra lane and a sign promising the expansion’s completion in spring 2013.
Plans were recently announced to widen the intersection of Route 7 and Route 40, but work has not commenced. Expansions of as many as half a dozen other key intersections, including the length of Route 22 between Route 40 and Interstate 95, remain stuck in development.
“I know it’s tough sledding,” said Mike Hayes, the Maryland Department of Business and Economic Development’s Military and Federal Adviser. “It’s going to be tough sledding for awhile.”
According to Richardson, a total of $57 million was secured for highway and transit projects, including $40 million from the state and $17 million by the local congressional delegation. But so far, that money has done little more than scratch the surface of one road.
Harford County Council President Billy Boniface, among those in attendance Wednesday, blamed a mix of a poor economy and political machinations for the delays.
“When BRAC was initiated, government revenues were in a different state,” he said. “Now priorities have shifted, politics are in play. The pie has gotten smaller.”
The development of mass transit remains even murkier. Craig and Richardson said a MARC study has been conducted to assess local needs, and there are plans for both an expansion of the Aberdeen station parking lot, and additions to MARC service over the next few years which would increase options for commuters to Aberdeen. There are also hopes of creating a mixed-use development near the station which would combine retail, commercial, and residential space. But on all of these, no real progress seems imminent.
Currently, only one northbound morning train from the Baltimore area stops at Aberdeen, arriving at 7:42 a.m. In the afternoon, only two southbound trains stop at that station: a pricey Amtrak ride departing at 5:19 p.m. and a later MARC train at 6:33 p.m.
APG began offering a government-run shuttle in early April to meet each train, but its efficiency and the extent of its use is unclear, and it remains the sole non-private option for reaching the installation’s main gates.
Hired Education
But there are other, deeper issues than simply how long the new APG employees may be stuck in traffic. Nearly all of those employees will be highly educated professionals, holding jobs which require specific training. While county figures show the local unemployment rate has hovered at about 2 percent below the national average, many of those under- and unemployed are not currently in a position to claim a BRAC-related job.
A handout at Wednesday’s meeting made the point directly with a frequently asked questions section including the simple request, “Can I still get a job?” The answer notes that, “Many of these positions will require a bachelor’s degree and a security clearance; all will require U.S. citizenship.”
Long-term, Sadowski said BRAC planners have partnered with local high schools to create magnet programs such as the Science and Mathematics Academy at Aberdeen High School and the Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness Program at Joppatowne High School. He said that those programs were direct efforts to try and interest students in the types of skills they would need to land jobs at APG.
Craig and Richardson said that a main focus of the BRAC private-public partnership in the near future would involve providing opportunities for workers to earn an advanced degree without leaving the area. Richardson pointed to several other successful regional technology areas which drew from advanced programs at nearby universities, such as the proximity of Stanford University to Silicon Valley.
Not all jobs created by BRAC will be at APG—the secondary economic effects of a highly-paid new workforce have long been touted as an important part of the county’s expected windfall. But the issue was not raised by the speakers at Wednesday’s program.
“I think the market finds a way,” Sadowski said.
The transportation problem and the need to gear the local population toward claiming high-tech jobs at APG remain ongoing concerns, Craig said, adding that the arrival of the Army’s deadline for BRAC was only the start of years of further work and partnership—leading up to the Army’s next round of BRAC decisions coming in 2015.
“We’re actually at the end of the beginning,” he said. “It’s like a marriage, it begins after you walk up the aisle and say, ‘I do.’ Sept. 15 is our wedding day.”
And when is someone going to look at getting businesses established on Route 40 to support this. Place still looks like a ghetto. We need more eating establishments like a Jersey Mike’ sub, Bagel Boys and a place with good chinese food.
Allow me to retort:
1) I’ve driven through ghettos before, both in and out of Maryland. Nowhere on Rt 40 in Harford County does it look like a ghetto. In places it looks like the economically depressed area that it is, with vacant storefronts. Rt 40 contains virtually no residential areas; it is almost entirely commercial real estate. Even in a good economy small businesses fail at an alarming rate, so it in the current economy it is even less likely for people to start new business ventures.
2) What is a Jersey Mike sub? What is a Bagel Boys? There are plenty of sub shops on or within a mile of Rt 40. There’s a Panera in Aberdeen between Rt 40 and I-95. There are half a dozen chinese restaurants in Harford County within a 10 minute drive of Rt 40 that are good. I’m definitely unsure as to why this need to satisfy your personal food cravings while staying on Rt 40 is so important to the economic development of the area. Care to explain?
Thanks for the comment, Jersey Mike is a sub shop that started n NJ many many years ago, they have many stores located throughout the US. It would be nice to see one near APG, yes I’ve had a sub at a few shops here in Maryland, frankly they don’t compare. bagel boys is another shop that was well estsb;pshed in the area of fort Monmouth in New jersey.
just looking for a few more establoshments for food close to APG. No I’m not looking to satisfy my personal cravings, just that of thousands folks that can relate. Route 40 has a very long way to go and I have mentioned this in the past, seems the business developers have missed the mark on this one but if they get on board they could make a differece.
Too bad we couldn’t get Bagel Boys BRAC’d. Anybody know of a decent bagel shop near APG?
I drive from Bel Air, so I stop at either Einstein Brothers on 24 or I believe it’s Bagel Works on 22. They open at 6am on weekdays.
Having lived in NYC, Central Jersey, and here, I will agree about the lack of quality eateries around here.
The nearest place I can find a true NY(NJ) bagel is Newark Bagel in Delaware. Best pizza/sub shop for someone with NJ tastes would be Franks on West Bel Air avenue in downtown Aberdeen.
Thanks for the tips. Wish there was a decent bagel shop near HdG.
Sorry to hear that you think the food doesn’t compare. Me personally, I absolutely love the bagels here. Einstein bros, Bagel works, and Panera bread. There’s also plenty of delicious, mouth watering, sub shops around. You just have to venture out and try a few smaller places. You might be suprised at what you find. Many of these places are within 5 miles of the APG.
Einstein, Panera.. good bagels,love ’em, but until you have a REAL bagel, they don’t compare. Now I want one. I always figured to get them, you drive to NJ or NY, not Rt. 40. 🙂
This is the way Harford County has been managed since the opening of the new Rt 24. The cart is always put before the horse. When 24 opened, it reminded me of of the way the gold rush must have been. The politians and developers went hog wild. The hell with the infrastructure, we’ll worry about that later. Build…build…build.
Thank God I’m retiring the end of December. I’ll watch the insanity unfold from my back porch in Pylesville sipping on a cup of coffee, thanking my lucky stars that I’m out of the rat race.
Yes, definitely. Infrastructure has always been a second thought in the county. Visionary planning here has historically had too narrow of a focus to properly handle long-term solid growth. Reactionary planning for incidental circumstances has been the main method of handling infrastructure overload, in-town gridlock, and the ant trails out to other counties.
Boosting the economy doesn’t necessarily mean boosting the quality of life.
You can’t talk to local Marylanders here about subs.. They always tell you go to Subway.. Yuck. I miss the good old Italian deli’s from Jersey..
Agree on Subway, can’t stomach that stuff. There’s a good point, Rt 40 is pretty barren for eateries, but with all the jobs coming into APG, that’ll change. I’ve heard that the Musical Inn is a good place for a sub, never had one myself but there is only one way to find out. Good Luck
I’d go a step further and say you can’t talk to local Marylanders here about food in general. I’ve been living in Harford County since 1985 and have always been annoyed at what constitutes “good food” around here. Subway, are you kidding me? It’s like eating “thick air”.
I’ve been working at APG for over a dozen years and have gone everywhere within a 20 minutes drive and unfortunately don’t have any recommendations outside of Panera or La Toleteca. I was hoping with BRAC we’d get some interesting new restaurants…Indian, Thai, Vietnamese, or whatever. So far nothing. Instead we’ll probably just get more chain crap. :-/
Scotto’s in Bel Air is decent. Other than that there is not much…
There is a Korean Restaurant in Aberdeen, fittingly called… Korean Restaurant
Prost is a very good German eatery.. in Aberdeen, but you need to make reservations as they have very few tables.
Savona in downtown Bel Air is a real Italian Deli.
There used to be a wonderful pizzeria in Riverside that made NJ type pizza with the thin crust if you requested it, but they went out of business. Not sure why, but I think it was because the locals didn’t want to pay more for good thin-crust pizza when Papa John’s was having specials left and right.
Frank’s Pizza is.. OK.
Sapore di Mare in Joppa is excellent Italian food made by real Italians, who are actually from Italy! 😉
Lee’s Hunan in Aberdeen (by Home Depot) makes decent Chinese food. They have made it the non-Americanized way for me when asked. Of course, if more people asked, they might actually put stuff on the menu that is more adventurous.
If you like Peruvian Chicken, there is a great place off 40 in Aberdeen called Super Chicken Rico.
Many of the above places are reachable from APG for lunch.
No bagels as good as Bagel Boys found, yet.
Open Door Cafe in Bel Air has decent food. I’d probably categorize it as New American.
You’re Welcome 🙂
I’d like to add that they’ll have to get more food varieties around here, but there are a few things that are pretty good if you do your homework.
For starters, why is there only one Vietnamese food place in Harford County, and it’s not the best?
And no Thai food?
And I have to admit to some IHOP cravings every now and then.
Portuguese and/or non-chain churrascaria would also be a big improvement.
I REALLY want a THAI place!
where is this vietanmese joint? I’d love to know. Please.
The place that has some Vietnamese Pho is Golden Szechuan Inn in Bel Air. It’s mainly a Chinese restaurant, but their Pho is OK. It’s pretty similar to the Pho served at Saigon II, but not like some excellent Vietnamese food you would find in the Detroit metro area, Toronto, or in VA. This is surprising because I was told there was a large Vietnamese Community living in Aberdeen pre-BRAC decision.
I have never found thin-crust pizza like Pete & Elda’s in NYC. I never did search that hard, though.
To be slightly on-topic. The traffic really has gotten terrible, but part of it is because of the school buses. I witnessed a parent holding up the school bus on 22 for well over 10 minutes as traffic continued to pile up.
You have many choices if you are in the Baltimore area, but I want to throw a shout out for Saigon Remembered across the street from the Senator theater. One of my favorite Vietnamese places.
Thanks Julie for the suggestions. I have never heard of Prost, but will definitely check it out. Thanks for reminding me of super chicken rico…love watching the guy with the cleaver “portion” your meal 😉
Lee’s is good, never tried ordering traditional…sounds interesting. Everything else is not practical for me as a lunch customer due to distance. I really hope we can get a couple authentic “foreign food” restaurants implanted before the chains come.
Restaurant Entrepreneurs: Untapped market here!
PS – To the person stuck in Edgewood: sorry, your predicament is much worse than mine. Good luck, but expect to pack for a while.
No such thing as NJ pizza, there is only NY pizza that you might find in other places than NY.
La Tolteca is excellent. A co-worker and I (we both came from Yuma AZ) enjoy going there for what can only be categorized as authentic Mexican Food. There are good places throughout the county. You just have to try them and see how they set with your particular tastes. I think I said before, for pub food, nothing beats Sean Bolan’s in Bel Air. Just keep trying and you will find places as good as where you came from.
I have to beg to differ about La Tolteca. I really don’t feel it is the best Mexican food, but the ONLY Mexican food in Harford County. Certain parts of its menu are good, while other items are substandard.
I grew up in Texas and have crossed the border from and eaten in El Paso and Brownsville many a time with friends at Mexican establishments.
La Tolteca pretty much sucks.
Try the new place, El Rodeo, and give a review.
I don’t know…in my experience from living in different parts of the country you can’t talk to people from the NY/NJ area about food period. You’d think that the only area of country that can make edible food in Northern NJ and NYC listening to them and everywhere else serves nothing but dog food by comparison…
Reggie – I get the feeling that people from other states can’t talk to most people from MD about food at all. Just because there aren’t a lot of food choices here, and people voice that opinion, then they are labelled as someone from NY/NJ. I have news for you. I’m not even originally from NY/NJ. I’ve lived in several parts of the US as well, and I think that Harford/Baltimore County has a dearth of good restaurant selections.
I’m not from MD either…I’ve only lived here for about 5 years.
In any case, I identify people as being from the NJ/NY area who either tell me that’s where they’re from (even if they weren’t originally) or they have that accent.
The college I went to also had a very large population from the NJ/NY area and while I had many friends from that area (and still do), many of them were pretty arrogant about a lot things when they compared anything to back home (especially food.)
In any case, I don’t think there has ever been a big demand for a wide variety of food choices in this area and that’s why mostly what you find are national chains or mediocre local places. If there really is as big of a demand for the types of places people are talking about on here then I’m sure someone will decide it’s a good business opportunity.
You’d have to be insane to think the food in Harford County compares to New York.
Of course there are more places with better food in NYC than in Harford County. You’re comparing a city of several million people from every culture in the world crammed into a fairly small area to a rural and suburban county of a couple hundred thousand people from a fairly homogenous background spread out over a larger area.
There are plenty of crappy places to eat in NYC just like there are plenty of good places to eat. The places you want to eat at simply don’t exist here. If you want those types of places you’re probably going to have to open them yourself or call up some of your favorites places in NYC and see if they’d want to try to open another place in this area. They probably won’t take the risk, but you never know.
I just don’t think given the demographics of the Edgewood and Aberdeen areas (especially close to base) there would be anywhere near enough business to support the places you’re looking for (and especially not the variety.)
I think what Reggie might be trying to say (and not really doing that good of a job of saying it), is that people from the northern NJ and NYC area always seem to expect the same variety and quality in food options wherever they go and when they don’t find it (which is usually the case unless they’re going to another huge metro area like that one) many tend to complain a lot and tell anyone who’ll listen about how much the food in the local area sucks and how great the food is back home. That’s bound to piss a few people off.
You have such great dining selection in NYC and northern NJ because there’s such a huge population (both who live there and who commute there for work) so there is a ton of competition which weeds out most of the really crappy places. Coming to a place like Harford County with a much smaller population spread out over a larger area and without all the diverse ethnic communities that you find in NYC and expecting the same types of food choices seems a bit naive to me.
It sounds like to me that there’s an untapped market for better food selection and maybe someone will decide to make a killing and try to serve that market. In the mean time there are a few decent places in the area (and more places the closer to Baltimore you get.) I think most of the ones in Harford County have been mentioned, but Box Hill Pizzeria off 924 has good pizza and crabcakes (they’re the same people who owned Riverside Pizzeria in Belcamp.) Sam’s Deli has pretty good subs and if you’re coming all the way out to Rt. 40 in Edgewood to hit up that filthy McD’s, Taco Bell, Burger King, etc then give Sam’s a try instead. It’s at the same intersection as those three places and one of the best, if not the best, place for a subs in Edgewood. I’d just suggest calling ahead to order if you’re short on time. Giovanni’s on Rt. 40 is also a pretty good Italian restaurant.
To be fair, there isn’t a great pizza place in Morris County, NJ either.
You have to leave to county to get anything decent. So there you go. NNJ does not have great pizza places on every corner.
Maybe you and others who are crying should try eating at restaurants that specialize in Chesapeake Bay/Maryland cuisine rather than wishing to recreate Jersey or Mexico here. When I went Mississippi I wasn’t demanding Maryland crab cakes, Maryland crab soup and stuffed rockfish. I was trying and loving gumbo, po-boys and fried catfish. If you are that dissatisfied here , you could always move back to New Jersey, Texas or somewhere else. I wouldn’t be offended, and we will be glad to have your jobs.
I think your comment is entirely BS! I’ve lived in Harford County for 10 years (Demil Job) and I can’t think of a single time anyone ever recommended Subway for “good” or even “great” subs. That’s not even an original phrase. I’ll bet you can look on dozens of relocation websites and see the exact same line. Sam’s Deli (on Rte 40, no less) in Edgewood has great subs. As for NJ subs, NY subs, PA subs, etc. They’re subs. I’ve lived in NY, TX, HI, SC, FL, MD and I’ve found that if you take some time to look around rather than just jumping on the bash a new location because I don’t know anything, it might actually help the cause.
On the other side of it, it boggled my mind to meet fully grown adults with children of their own who had never even eaten asparagus or avocado. It’s not like they are extremely exotic. Klein’s (before they were shoprite carried both. Heck, even Wal-mart carries these vegetables.
And by the way, when I asked about places to eat, I was told (by this same individual) that Subway was the only thing around.
Hey Greg— I have an idea–go back to Jersey and get your sub! You’re in Maryland–eat what we eat……When we go to Jersey (which will be never) we’ll try your sub–when you’re here–eat crabs
Subway’s ok, but I’m not really a big sub eater. I’d much rather have a crab cake sandwich or a soft shell crab. There are some smaller sub places in Havre de Grace and Aberdeen. You just have to know where to look.
Keep complaining about the food options near APG-North, those of us at APG-South get to pick between the on-post Subway, the always under-stocked candy machine, or driving 20min to a dirty McDonalds, Taco Bell or Burger King. I’d love a Panera nearby.
I’m curious what you think about My Three Sons? They make OK gyros.
Also, you have the most wonderful donuts in Edgewood. I think the place is called Sun Moon cafe off 755, and the owners are Chinese.
Coming from Monmouth, I was used to the 1 hour lunch break, so I guess if you only have half hour, it’s a little harder.
Panera will be coming to Abingdon a little after Wegman’s. Wegman’s usually has excellent lunches, too.
Plus, if you are in Edgewood, you are a hop skip and jump away from Sapore di Mare.
Ohhhh I love Sun Moon Cafe! They make all of the donuts from scratch! Even all the icing and frosting is from scratch. The owners are actually Korean and very friendly. Such a small hidden gem. A coworker actually told me about that place and I stopped by one morning. I’ve never been there for lunch but I heard it’s good for a small sandwich shop type place. I used to call ahead and order my breakfast and then pick it up on my way in. With only one cook, if the line is busy, a sandwich may take a little while.
Common – Thanks for the correct. I wasn’t too sure as I only saw them in the back every time I went there. I do miss Sun Moon Cafe’s sandwiches too. It’s smart to call ahead than order while you’re there during the lunch rush, although most people skip this little gem.
Julie,
Have you ever tried La Cucina in Havre De Grace? Also have good Italian food. I haven’t been to the one you mentioned Sapore di Mare. Where exactly is it?
Common –
Sapore di Mare is in Joppa off of Joppa Farm Road (back behind the Redner’s). I think it might be 500 Joppa Farm Road, but don’t quote me on that.
I will try La Cucina in HdG and give a review when I have the chance. Less chance to try places around here as my workload has increased over the years.
500 Joppa Farm Rd is the Royal Farms near Mariner Point Park.
Everything in that shopping center is 1000-something Joppa Farm Rd.
I’ve also heard that Maria D’s is decent (it’s next to the new Wawa on Rt 152@I95), but I’ve never eaten there.
DW – It isn’t in that shopping center. It is further back off of Joppa Farm road by a swim club.
Sorry, I thought you were saying that it was in the same shopping center as the Reddner’s.
DW – No worries. I wasn’t very clear in my comment.
I second Sapores, thats the best local spot for pizza and delicous seafood/pasta specials. Plus they support their local schools and recreation teams.
My Three Sons has become our default carry out joint.
But I’m not from NY or NJ so I don’t count.
For all you newcomers;
There are many great places int this county where the food is beyond excellent. The cold cruel fact of life is that this is Maryland. None of us who have been calling this home ever wanted to be in New Jersey. I have been stationed in NJ twice and that is the only State, where I spent any amount of time, that I never wanted to go back to. Yes, one of those assignments was at Monmouth. We who call this place home are more than willing to welcome you and make you feel at home. When you have earned it, we’ll even tell you where the really good eating spots are. In the mean time, if you want a great Philly cheese steak go to Philly. If you want a great bagel go where there is a large grouping of Jews. We have our fair share of Asian, Fusion, and German spots. We are not the type of folk who particularly want Ethiopian or Somalian, or Congolese or any other exotic menus. Join us or leave us but quit your damned belly aching.
Wow Dave, nice way to come across like a snobby arrogant a-hole. Being a “local” myself you certainly don’t speak for me. Harford County is populated heavily by transplants, get used to it. The “Maryland rules, NJ sucks” attitude is childish and obnoxious.
Again, I hope BRAC at APG will inspire some more creative eating establishments near post.
Aaron – Civs and contractors can eat at the trough-style cafeteria, and it’s quite inexpensive. I personally would rather brown-bag it instead of eating there…but it is an option.
Being a snobby, arrogant, know it all a-hole is what Yensan does best. That, and lose political campaigns. Maybe if he’d gotten elected, he could have enticed more restaurants to Aberdeen. But probably not. I think I’ll go to where “the Jews are” and round up some bagels. Or maybe I’ll just go to Bagel Works in Bel Air which makes a pretty damn good bagel. Yensan will just spend his day being an ass.
Dave,how can you say that. You aren’t even from Maryland. You are from Western New York, amazing!
Let’s not disparage all of Western New York by affiliating it with one person who is from there. We had great pizza and hot dogs where I grew up there. It would be arrogant to suggest that the food here in Maryland is somehow inferior. And I for one, would be glad to point out the good places to eat, to the newcomers, unlike the other fellow.
Some pretty good suggestions here. My family has been going to Scotto’s for more than 15 years, it’s the only Italian place my late great-grandmother, a second-generation Italian, would ever eat out at.
As far as lunch though, whichever part of APG you work at, remember that a lot of these places “near” post aren’t so near when you factor in the time it takes just to get from your desk to the front gates.
Right now there’s not much for civilian and contractor personnel as far as on-base lunch options. A Subway that’s always slammed, a Burger King that was equally busy (and not very healthy) when it wasn’t under major construction, and a pretty good pit-beef place. But all get overwhelmed at lunchtime.
I’m still unclear what the rules are for civilian and/or contractor personnel eating at the post dining hall (shot on sight? added to the “secret sauce”?). But that’s really what’s needed: a cafeteria-style place that can serve a ton of decent food to a large number of people at about the same time. No chain place is really set up to do that–imagine how bad a Chipotle would get at noontime.
The numbers in the story show how APG is losing almost all of its uniformed personnel, but gaining thousands upon thousands of civilians and contractors. There’s no reason they couldn’t be fed the same way the garrison of old was.
Aaron – The post dining hall (DFAC) has been opened up to Civilians and Contractors. It is cash only at $4.25, and you have to show ID.
I understand the dining hall will be closing to civilians shortly. The post Restaurant Fund is trying desperatly to keep the old O club afloat (now called The Top Of The Bay) at the inconvenience of all the post employees. They do this by limiting the choices and restricting the size of the establishments. Remember when they closed the old cafateria just outside gate 13?
The Pizza is better in Jersey and NY! The crabs are better here! Aberdeen does have a lack of restaurants and variety.
I like that every comment is about food. Obviously strong opinions. Not one word about the article…..
The thing that people from Jersey got used to (me being one of them) is trying all different types of foods. Seems like local Marylanders here are crazy about crabs. I like crabs, but I also like a lot of other foods. I for one would just settle with finding good pizza here and a good sub place. Sadly, I have found none. That being said, I love Maryland in general. My only complaint is with it’s food. But yes local Marylanders, you have the best crabcakes in the world. It is just some of us like other food other than crabs..
Greg,
saying there isn’t good pizza in Harford countly is like saying you can’t find crabs in Maryland. To be honest, NY coal oven pizza is way over rated! Transplants have to realize thay no longer live a stones throw from one of the largest citys in the world. Havre de Grace has 9 places to get Pizza, all good and each fairly different. Subs, well I’m going to agree with you in general, there are some decent places, but Marylanders generally have a different style of sub, especially when it comes to the roll most places use(YUK!) I’s a life long Har co resident, but I grew up eating southern PA sytyle hoagies and you’re not going to find anything even close. BIG heaping piles of fresh thin sliced deli meats on a beautiful fresh Amoroso’s roll. At least a few are stepping up their bread game Something we don’t have a lot of (thank God!)is chain resturants thses folks will be familiar with, and anything called “Jersey Joes”, wellll, probably was’t gonna do so well anyway.. Focus on local eateries, which we have many, however I agree we could use a little more variety however You’ll have to learn that Baltimore has great dining and I don’t mind that drive. I hear Prost is likely buying another resturant just across the street on Rt 40 and moving in the near future, so maybe they’ll have a few more tables.
Good bagels I agree are hard to come by, but Bagel Works (in Bel Air) makes bagels as good as any I’ve had in the NYC area. They are a local chain, maybe they will see fit to open somewhere on the way into APG. I would love a REAL mexican resturant or even a decent taqueria. LaTolteca is meh but hey, it’s there. I’d kill for a decent taco al Pastore. Something you may learn is we used to have a lot more ethnic variety in the area thanks to APG, and most of it has dissapeared or became homogenized with the draw-down of the active duty personnel on base in the 90’s.
Part of the problem with Aberdeen’s dining choices is the town had lost a lot of it’s personnel over the years and was no longer focused on supporting the post. Aberdeen used to be just like every other town surrounding a large post, but it had learned to survive. Lately the active duty folks were mainly students and were young soldiers didn’t have or didn’t bring their families with them as they had through the 70’s and 80’s rarely ventured off base. There has been no demand for variety in Aberdeen. You’ll learn, Bel Air gets all the attention in this county, and to be honest, I’m good with that, I can stay away from it all. In aberdeen, there is no “Main Drag” into base where businesses are focused on the comuters in and out of base. With the base changing the focus of traffic to the renovated south gate away from what used to be the main RT 22 gate, there’s currently zero busineses focused on providing services to folks coming and going from the base and Rt 22 was constructed to bypass downtown Aberdeen and the original gate that is closed.
Complaining about the lack variety on food in Harford is like complaining about the price of a pizza in Hawaii. It shows a total lack of understanding of where you are.
That said..thankfully it seems like food and taxes are the only things transplants complain about.
Let me put into perspective the frustration our new neighbors may be having. If your job forced you to move to a place where you could not get steamed crabs (only boiled, which is how they do it almost everywhere outside of our area), you would be asking the locals if there was anywhere that made crabs correctly; and it may come off as a complaint. Food is very important to people, and in New Jersey they have grown up and become accustomed to variety and having things prepared certain ways.
I missed people complaining about taxes, but when these folks buy houses they will stop complaining, our real estate taxes are less.
And to the Jets fans moving in… you get to follow the breeding ground for much of your talent.
I’m blown away at the contempt that some people have for anyone who did not take their first breath somewhere within the bounds of Harford County. You sure are happy they’re buying Harford County houses and paying Harford/MD taxes so how ’bout you drop it? You live in Maryland, not utopia! It’s a nice place to live – period. There are tons of nice places to live in the US, but work often forces moves otherwise not considered.
Many of the above critiques of local eating are accurate but to most people from PA, NJ or NY, they will be disappointed (except for crabs of course). Stick to the crabs, and then try your hand at making from scratch the great Italian or other ethnic food you grew up on. After scores of attempts around the county I only found a small handful of places that made a pizza the way I like it but I don’t want to drive that far – now I only make pizza at home (crust, sauce and even the mozzarella) and it’s as good as NJ, Philly and Brooklyn (NY that is).
I am STUNNED! With all the work that needs to be done to ensure a fostering community, the majority of comments are about bagels and NY pizza! It is true that “natives” can be resentful of new comers. They built a mall where I once rode my bike on the race track. They tore down my tree house to build townhouses. They’ve sold off countless farms to put in drab shopping centers. And they’ve plowed under my golf course to build houses during the worse housing economy in our history. Many of us, new-comers included, cherish our rural environment. In the era of “Jersey Shore” it can be rather off-putting to hear so many recent arrivals complaining that we don’t have a… cosmopolitan environment. Tread gently. Many of us prefer to live miles from places you lament us not having.