Interim Superintendent for Harford County Public Schools Pat Skebeck said today that the school board is planning to make a decision on the next superintendent within the next week to ten days. Skebeck said the board would then make an offer to the selected candidate followed contract negotiations, with a public announcement expected during the week of June 7.
In the meantime, The Dagger has made an effort to reach out to Dr. Carl Roberts and Dr. Franklin Till, Jr., the two candidates we were unable to interview last week, to give them with the opportunity to answer some of your questions. We’ll let you know how that works out.
Today, we bring you the last of the four finalists who have come to Harford County for a round of stakeholder interviews, Dr. Robert Tomback from Baltimore County Public Schools. You know the drill. Background information is posted below, along with some links of interest. Questions and answers are paraphrased, unless otherwise noted.
Q. What new initiatives would you bring to HCPS?
A. That’s difficult to answer. Prior to any new initiatives, I would want to understand and learn more about what’s working and what is not. It would be irresponsible on my part, without planning and discussing that first with the board of education and other stakeholders, to make changes. It would not be an appropriate leadership style. That is not to say that school systems shouldn’t change. “I do believe complacency is the enemy of an effective organization.” However, “I would not expect radical change right off the bat.”
Q. You are a district superintendent in Baltimore County?
A. Baltimore County Public Schools are divided into 5 areas. My district is in the northeast, with 34 schools and 25,000 students in elementary, middle and high school, and alternative education. I am responsible for “moving the instructional program forward.”
Q. What is your position on some of the controversial programs in place in Harford County such as the block schedule?
A. There are some advantages and disadvantages. I was the principal at a school which had the block schedule [Catonsville HS] but we modified it over time. One of the main advantages is that without adding any more staff, teaching capacity could be increased by 12%. Another advantage is that students have the opportunity to take more advanced courses and also interventions. But for instrumental music and for AP courses, we modified the block to provide for year-long classes on alternating (A/B) days.
Q. How about Everyday Math?
A. I’m not familiar; I would need to gather more information. “Evaluation would be key.”
Q. What is your leadership style?
A. “My leadership style is flexible.” I don’t subscribe to any one leadership approach. Leadership needs to adapt to the situation.
Q. In Harford County, and in the rest of the country, there are large percentages of high school graduates who need remedial coursework in college. What have you done or what would you do to address this issue?
A. “I would question the data source.” I don’t necessarily believe it’s true. If you are looking at the SOAR (Student Outcome and Achievement Report), SOAR is limited in that it only reports on students who have taken the SAT and who attended a Maryland college. It doesn’t provide all the data. That is not to say that a problem doesn’t exist. Part of the remedy is to have clear communication between HCPS and the colleges to make sure there is an alignment between what is taught in high school and what is taught in college. And the Voluntary State Curriculum has to be aligned.
Q. How will you be accessible to the community?
A. The key word is “accessibility” and not waiting for others to come to you. It means going out to the schools, to PTA meetings and community forums. It is essential for the community to get to know the new superintendent. There has to be a willingness to communicate.
Q. You have talked about communication, but what about parental and public involvement in decision-making?
A. Many of those opportunities already exist. Some of the biggest are School Improvement Teams and PTAs – which are not just for fundraising. These opportunities involve input with school personnel.
Q. What have you done in the past that has worked to retain experienced teachers and to bring teachers to areas of need?
A. A key component is making sure you’ve selected the very best candidates. That involves looking at sources that have provided the best candidates in the past and having an attractive package to offer.
Q. The best sources, such as?
A. We’d have to look at that. Once teachers are on the job, it is essential to support them to the greatest extent possible in the first year and beyond with curriculum, class management, etc. That includes mentors in school, in class and being able to talk to other teachers and share ideas. Aside from mentors, principals, assistant principals and a host of other individuals also provide support.
Q. What programs would you offer for students who are not planning to go to college?
A. Just because students are not going to college doesn’t mean there is no training after high school. I believe we do our students a service by making sure doors aren’t closed. Students need career pathways, essential skills (both academic and technical). Our job is not finished with certification in a technical field. Certification is at the entry level and still requires additional training; students need academic skills for future training.
Q. Can you talk about career pathways and magnet schools in Harford County?
A. I’d need to know more in Harford County. In Baltimore County, we want students to move into the most rigorous career pathway. Most of our students follow the college completer program. In Northeast Baltimore County, we are thinking about BRAC and high technology opportunities. Similar to the program in Harford County, Baltimore County will be getting a Homeland Security program in the future. What’s most important is to help students understand their options.
Here is the official biography released by HCPS:
Dr. Robert Tomback
Dr. Tomback earned his Doctor of Philosophy, Human Development Education at the University of Maryland. He serves as Area Assistant Superintendent, Baltimore County and is instructional and administrative leader for 34 schools and approximately 25,000 students. Before becoming assistant superintendent in 2007, he was a principal, executive assistant, assistant principal, department chair and social studies teacher. He is a member of the American Association of School Administrators, American Educational Research Association and the Association for Supervision and Curriculum Development. He has made several presentations at the American Educational Research Association. Dr Tomback has developed several professional development courses and has published a number of articles. He is past president, Maryland Council for Social Studies and a member of the STEM Task Force, Technology Planning Committee, and Home-Base Advisory Committee, Baltimore County Public Schools.
And some related links:
http://www.education.umd.edu/news/news2008/wnr0811AlumAwards.html
http://www.catonsvillerotary.org/charitable.htm
Personally I like him the best from what I have read.
He questioned the source for large percentages needing remediation. Here is a link for something fresh out of the NY Times, his hometown paper.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/28/ed…8remedial.html
There isn’t much information about the candidates so where is the reading material about them. It is extremely important to have a good leader to take over since there hasn’t been anyone in this position for several months. Someone who has never been a superintendent may take longer to get used to the job. Dr. Haas took over years ago without a lot of experience, but that was long before NCLB. He hasn’t had to make the final decisions and deal with the public and elected officials. I also have doubts about the other candidate who is very closely aligned with MSDE and Annapolis. I think Dr. Haas went awry when she started spending a lot of time in Annapolis and a lot less time here. Sucking up to MSDE doesn’t seem to help Harford County much anyway. We don’t get any more money for programs and we don’t get any more money for school construction. I would like a superintendent who would stand up to the State Board of Education and many of the ridiculous unfunded mandates we have.
School construction is the legislative function of the general assembly. Also BCPS is a differnet monster. Larger systems tend to split into areas, and depending on the superintendent, grant a certian amount of autnomy to the area superintendent which Tomback is. Harriston then make decision in consultation with these people. If you micromanage a large system you miss things.
Not from here your link does not work. But I interpret his comments to say there is a lot of research both ways on the subject and that if one is refering to a specific study he mentioned then he finds flaws in the study and it alone is not a reliable study. He says he is not denying that it may be a problem but he would have to look at all the data to come up with a solid conclusion. That tells me he is not going to rush to act but carefully think about what is best for the students. Something I think we all want.
As a parent of a past AP student, I hope he modifies the AP schedule as he hinted had happened in Baltimore County. With every other day meetings, AP students must cover pre-Columbian history through present day. “Regular” U.S. History covers 1865-modern day in the same amount of time. How can you cover 400 extra years in the same amount of time? If this is the case in U.S. History, I am sure that it is the case in other AP courses.
Here’s hoping he tackles that so that our students who want the challenge of an AP course have the time to really learn the material in a more advanced setting.
Realist, I asked Dr. Tomback what modifications were made to the block schedule at Catonsville HS and the every-other-day schedule IS the modification that he said they made. A traditional block schedule would have had AP classes (and all other classes) given every day for one semester only.
I wish I’d had more time to explore this issue, but it was early in the interview and I had a lot of other good topics to cover (thanks to Dagger readers like you!)
Try this link: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/28/education/28remedial.html?ref=education
Here’s the Reader’s Digest Version; “More than 60 percent of students enrolling at two-year colleges, and 20 percent to 30 percent at four-year colleges, take remedial courses.” But “Precise accounting is impossible” due to poor state level record keeping. This is nation-wide.
The problem is that the school districts are counting on the “Voluntary state curriculum” to tell them what to do instead of doing their own research.
Thanks for that clarification Cindy. So, in reality, nothing would change on that front. I don’t see how AP teachers cover what they need to!
Sorry for the bum link–I copied and pasted a link I had used. PMS Mom’s works. Thanks. Anybody who thinks that remediation isn’t a problem is a bit out of the loop. It isn’t a new problem either, so I was a bit surprised that Dr. Tomback would question the source of the figures as if many students weren’t taking remedial classes.
On the AP questions, there is research that shows that block schedule students do not score as well as those who take a class every day. Whoever is hired should be interested in that research. I do hope that the person they hire is more interested in middle and high school issues because as far as I am concerned the older kids are the ones who were ignored under the last adminstration. I was quite happy with HCPS for my children even through most of middle school.
His answer of denial regarding the kids needing post -high school remediation was quite a stunner. He questions the data source; then says he doesn’t necessarily believe its true; then he says he’s not saying it isn’t a problem. Sounds like he’ll fit right in with Volrath’s and Wolkow’s double-talk .
Say it ain’t so. Let’s hope it didn’t come out the way he meant it. We must hope for the best until accountability reigns.
Actually, I just had an idea regarding the apparent double-talk of the candidate and the confirmed double-talk of the likes of Volrath: We could get Tom Fidler to re-join the band and we could have a “what the heck did he just say – a – palooza”.
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He did not deny that it was a problem. He said that one specific study was not a good one and that he would have to see a lot of data. The HCC study is not a good study for a variety of reasons. He said there may be a problem. Some people don’t seem to think the push by colleges to remedial courses may be self serving? Kids take non-credit courses and pay money resulting in them staying school longer and paying tuition?
CDEV – Are you in one of the groups that interviewed him? HCC isn’t a profit organization so I hope they aren’t making money. I think they lose money in some areas of the college and make it up in others. Apparently the division of the college that makes money is the Non-Credit. Some departments of the college are trying to keep themselves afloat because of decreased enrollment, but Math and English do not fall in that category.
Career pathways – what is the most popular TV show right now because that is a “career pathway” that many kids will be interested in. Forensic Science wasn’t a major 10 years ago but it is now because of CSI even though what the kids see on TV is very different from coursework they take.
No
I know it is not for profit but it helps it remain fiscally solvent and I was talking about colleges in general since it seems people had been worried about students nationally.
They do not have decreased enrollement but they offer the most remediation courses too I bet.
I was not present at this question and answer session. However, the question about remediation quoted here did not cite a source of the information but instead made a fairly vague reference to required remediation across the country, which is factual.
Colleges, particularly public colleges, gain nothing financially by having students take remedial courses. It just costs money because taxpayers off-set the cost of college classes after taxpayers pay for public schools. The cost of education at public colleges and universities is far more than any student pays in tuition. That’s why if your Maryland kid goes to college in, let’s say Virginia, you are going to pay a $20,000 premium for your out-of-state student. And, it’s harder to get in as an out-of-state student. Hmmmm, perhaps that’s because the other states don’t want to have the cost of remediation (just an idea).
Then add in all the students who are taking classes and getting federal financial aid and it costs us again. I am beginning to sound like a Republican. And anyone in education should be well aware of this problem because it is a big, old problem. Perhaps Baltimore County does such a great job that its students don’t need any remediation when they head to college. I think I’ll call CCBC on Monday.
First off the HCC study is extremely screwed up. It selected abunch of kids who where likely to need remediation by removing kids who did not go to community college, got High SAT scores and so on. The it tested them and found out most of the group with low SAT scores or no SAT scores going to a community college needs remedial courses….Go figure! Those insisting this guy is denying a problem exist are not reading the same paraphrase in it’s entirty. This guy simply said he would have to look at the data and new of a particular study which people cite that he fealt the methodology was flawed. He seems very data driven! Show him data with good methodology then he will act. Unlike the uniform survey which had a methodology of sending home parent survey’s with high school and middle school kids. How many of those do you think actually got filled out by parents of the ones returned.
Cdev, what HCC study do you keep talking about? Do you have a link to it so that we can all read it?
Also the HCC study isn’t perfect by any means but why hasn’t anyone from HCPS undertaken this type of study? What is it that they continually ignore data about high school reform? I am more concerned about that then a group of scientists from APG who tried with the information they had to reach a conclusion knowing they didn’t have access to data or said data was never requested by HCPS. Everyone in this county should be questioning why citizens are paying twice for basic skills – first in public school and then in college. Dr. Tomback may have a legitimate point but the remediation problem at HCC is nothing new. Parents have a right to expect that students who have passed Algebra 2 and beyond with A and B grades would be able to take college math without having to take remedial coursework. Maybe the HSA should be replaced with the Accuplacer test since most counties in the state use it anyway.
I didn’t cite any data in my question about college remediation rates.
After saying he would question the data source, Dr. Tomback raised the SOAR report as an example, because SOAR only studies students who have taken the SATs and who attend MD colleges. He asked if that was my source and I told him it was, in part.
What’s interesting is that SOAR studies the very students who would arguably be the most prepared for college and the figures from the latest SOAR report show that even this sub-group of students had a significant need for remediation in math.
In fact, the study showed that nearly 1/3 of recent MD high school graduates who had taken a college prep curriculum in high school needed remedial math classes in MD colleges. In MD community colleges, the number shoots to 56% for the state and 69% in Baltimore County (where Dr. Tomback is an assistant superintendent).
http://www.mhec.state.md.us/publications/research/AnnualReports/2008SOAR.pdf
i never mentioned the HCC study which looked at another sub-group of students and found even higher remediation rates. But these students hadn’t taken the SATs or got scores below a cut-off used by HCC and many other MD community colleges.
While I would heartily agree that more comprehensive data is needed (which the APG analysts and others have also called for), there is certainly enough information here and in national studies to support the premise that there is a problem to be addressed.
Not from here it was the one reported on here a few weeks back.
Stakeholder I do not know whyit hasn’t been looked at. It obviously does. To say that it should just have dawned on HCPS is a stretch since after these kids leave they do not see what happens. HCC has a better idea because they are dealing with it. I would venture to say the Algebra 2 issue partly due to the fact that math is a use it or lose it skill. I took Calc 3 in college but alas 10 years later I could not do much calculus if I had to. That is because I do not use it. When a kid takes 3 credits of math as was required in 2005 (the kids in the data sample) that is a senior year of no math for the kids who say I hate math so I am not taking extra. When they go to college they do poorly on placement tests and need remediation. One thing we did do to correct this is add the requirement for 4 math credits. Maybe this was deliberate maybe not but we would need to see what this did for kids before we say we did nothing.
Cindy, I got the impression from your synopsis of his response that it needs more study and he is open to that idea. Is that a correct interpretation you heard it all in order of what he said.? You lead off up top with the “I would question the data source” Was it said in a manner indicating he would scrutinize and evaluate the data; or the denial like it can not be true and must be ignored manner? There is a difference between scrutinizing data and ignoring it.
“I would question the data source” was the first thing Dr. Tomback said in answer to my question. Maybe he believes that more study is needed, but that’s not what he said at the time.
The rest of my synopsis is in order.
He also said part of the “remedy” (his word) would be to ensure there is curricular alignment between high school and college. So, he was not completely denying a problem exists. But he didn’t fully embrace the idea either.
“Maryland and 45 other states announced Monday that they will adopt common national standards for what should be taught in classrooms from kindergarten through high school in reading and math.” From today’s Baltimoresun.com
Things just got a little more interesting.